Shadowdoom9 (Andi)'s Forum Replies

Now that the ability to add your own top 20 releases to your profile page has been added, I think we can retire using this thread. I will, but I don't know about the rest of you, whether you wanna keep using it or switch to the new feature.

Just done my list. Thanks for implementing this ability, Ben! https://metal.academy/users/profile/97/top-20

Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you a band who's sole claim to fame is that they were on M-A's top 100 list of bands by number of full-lengths...Baboon/Baboon Rising. And also used to not have any reviews whatsoever, which was irrespective of quality, they just weren't on the internet.

https://rateyourmusic.com/artist/baboon_rising

In RYM, no ratings at all, and the last two albums are missing.

Maybe even reviews of album covers...

Welcome, Morpheus!

Try to find some good metal in this hardcore sh*tter. SPOILER: There's barely any.

Post-sludge metal should certainly have its own category in order to be distinguished from post-metal or sludge metal releases, and it's more significant and easier to see which genre it's most likely to stay in than a subgenre label like post-black metal that's torn between two subgenres (atmospheric black metal and blackgaze). Now let's say there are releases like Isis' The Red Sea that have both the Post-Metal and Sludge Metal tags but DON'T say "Atmospheric Post-Sludge Metal", they probably have both genres dominant without necessarily being just a subgenre where one genre stands out more than the other. So the Post-Sludge Metal subgenre would still make sense if you're looking for a style of post-metal where sludge is only secondary, which is basically what Post-Sludge is.

Once again, post-sludge has the slow tempo and harsh vocals of regular sludge, but otherwise, it puts its focus on the intense atmosphere, lengthy structures, and crescendo themes of post-metal, all that more superior to the sludgy aspects. With a lot more in common with post-metal, that's why I think it should be treated as more of an Infinite subgenre than The Fallen. For post-black metal, it's more related to blackgaze bands like Alcest and Deafheaven than atmospheric black metal, with the latter subgenre more synth-oriented than the dreamy ambience of post-metal. You wouldn't call bands like Summoning and Burzum "post-metal", now would you? For post-death metal, there are only 4 releases here that mix post-metal and death metal, so that wouldn't qualify as a real subgenre.

Another post-x subgenre, huh? How about post-hardcore! Just kidding. Haha

I enjoy the experimental chaos of mathcore, but I don't think I found as many releases from that subgenre as most other metalcore/melodic metalcore subgenres. Fortunately, thanks to a few grand discoveries in my rediscovery voyage, I now have enough for a top 10, which I'm sharing right here:

1. Botch - We Are The Romans (1999)

2. Converge - You Fail Me (2004)

3. Every Time I Die - Radical (2021)

4. Gaza - I Don’t Care Where I Go When I Die (2006)

5. The Dillinger Escape Plan - Calculating Infinity (1999)

6. Deadguy - Fixation on a Coworker (1995)

7. Coalesce - Give Them Rope (1997)

8. Knut - Challenger (2002)

9. Iwrestledabearonce - Ruining It for Everybody (2011)

10. Psyopus - Odd Senses (2009)

I'm amazed by Unbroken's 9-minute epic to shape up top-notch progressive-ish hardcore/metalcore for a metallic future:

A sneak peek to their next album System Overload in their Hookedlung compilation, with a nice Danzig/Sabbath influence in the pace:

Epic melodeath-inspired metalcore from that short-lived underrated band:

Fantastic metalcore with black/death metal influences from this band in which 3 of the members would later form Between the Buried and Me:

Prayer for Cleansing is obviously not deathcore, nor the first ever metalcore band, but they would help in developing metalcore's deathly side, with brutal growls of anger and sorrow, and fast heaviness in the music. A lot of hardcore/metalcore now has more association with the aspects of this band's sound. So if you're looking for the band that started the ongoing Gothenburg-inspired metalcore trend, the answer is right here. You can hear a lot of violent heaviness from the blast-beat sections and breakdowns, along with a decent amount of melody in places. Rain in Endless Fall is pretty much the roots of not only Between the Buried and Me (the band 3 of the Prayer for Cleansing members would form) but also the majority of mixing melodic metalcore with extreme influences. There's barely a single thing to make you disappointed!

5/5

I plan to review their EP The Tragedy (that won't be part of my metalcore journey), but other than that, we've reached the end of my metalcore subgenre voyage. Once again, I'm gonna try discovering a few extra releases from those times to add more year variety in later Revolution playlists, and that would be a different small journey that isn't part of this thread. Anyway...that's all in this thread, folks!

Embodyment dumped all their early deathcore roots for this album, but the heaviness still remains there in alt-rock/metal songs like this one:

From the album that marks the true start of deathcore. Surely, bands like Despised Icon, Suicide Silence, and Whitechapel wouldn't exist without it.

Now this is more like it! Here we have the band that really kickstarted deathcore, and that is Embodyment! Something interesting is the band's Christian background that was highly unusual in death metal at that time. Whether you're fan of Christian metal or death metal/core, Embrace The Eternal is a must-listen, with influences from Suffocation, Morbid Angel, and for the idea of Christian death metal, Mortification. Kris McCaddon has done great primal vocal work, and there is some melodic yet dissonant riffing that alone would be the big bang for bands like Suicide Silence, Whitechapel, and maybe even Knocked Loose. McCaddon would've made the band more popular and staying in their deathcore sound if he didn't leave the band. Yep, after his departure, their 3 subsequent albums embraced a melodic alt-metal/rock sound, getting softer album after album until they split after the 4th. Members of the original lineup would start a short-lived project, The Famine. Anyway, it's this album that would fully pioneer deathcore and set the stage for bands like Despised Icon and Suicide Silence. An underrated gem for a new deathly beginning!

5/5

Up next, after reviewing their alt-metal second album The Narrow Scope of Things (of course that won't be part of my metalcore journey), I plan to review one more album that isn't deathcore but rather an early example of metalcore mixed with death metal influences, and that would mark the end of this voyage through the early releases of standard metalcore and its subgenres. Though like I said before, I might try discovering a few extra releases from those times to add more year variety in later Revolution playlists. Stay tuned...

Well this EP did not have much that I enjoyed. The hardcore-death metal sounded like quite a mess compared to anything in month-long journey so far. This is what should be put down instead of the much better over-hated modern deathcore bands. I have a much better early deathcore album to review later today, but in the meantime, here's the link to my review for this poor attempt at deathcore invention: https://metal.academy/reviews/24416/18004

One of Damaged's attempts to change their style in different directions came out as a poor sh*tter:

An extreme-yet-melodic-influenced mix of deathgrind and prototypical deathcore:

Well, I've made another attempt in continuing my early deathcore path, and I have a feeling it might turn out better than my first attempt, with more apparent proto-deathcore elements in this album:

My thoughts:

Deathcore was practically unheard of when this album was released 25 years ago. Back then, very few extreme bands from Australia were known outside their homeland, even Damaged. Anyone who thought groove metal bands like Pantera and White Zombie were the heaviest would have their minds blown away, if they've ever stumbled upon this then-rare token. The album has good loud production, suitable for this deathgrind/proto-deathcore band. Here we have earth-quaking drums, sonic guitar distortion, and incomprehensible screaming vocals. The songs can range from slow boring distortion to fast interesting aggression! It sounds as if the latter was one of Slipknot's heavier influences, with some similar riffing to be found in that band's debut album two years later. The vocals some threaten to reach that level in their weaker songs, particularly in the first half, which really lessens the fun mood. However, track #4 by mixing their deathgrind/deathcore sound with more extreme yet melodic influence than just nu metal. I would suggest just listening to that track, followed by track #7 onwards then stop before the hidden track. There are probably better extreme metal bands out there, for me anyway, but Damaged is as much as I'm up to going into the deathgrind genre, though there's a decent amount of proto-deathcore as well. I can only recommend this to fans of this kind of sound with lots of noise and variety. I probably don't plan to explore the death side of deathcore any time soon, other than one more album from a different band. But at least half of this album is a grand blast....

3.5/5

One more conventional metalcore album I was planning to review was the debut album from Hatebreed, Satisfaction Is the Death of Desire, but it's not yet added to Metal Academy. While I wait, I'll review some more albums including the debut from Cable that's finally added here (thanks Ben!):

My thoughts:

Do you ever wonder if you think there should be something altered in its history without lowering too much of its value? That is a frequent thought, isn't it? When you don't know if what you think would be more suitable for a band that would've caused them to rise higher or fall lower. You can't change the past, but you can live with what's available. That feeling I can have listening to Cable's debut Variable Speed Drive, which is still marked an enjoyable mathy metalcore escapade! Cable evolved through the over 25 years since they've released their debut, and they've made 7 full-length albums and a couple EPs, splits, and compilations. Before switching to sludge in subsequent albums, Variable Speed Drive bashes through 90s noise-metalcore at as much tremendous ease as Deadguy. There's massive discordance along with occasional pleasant melody, and the anger and passion makes up for the slight unpolished mistakes, from doom-ish to hardcore. Variable Speed Drive has intrigued hardcore/metalcore fans by adding elements that barely co-existed before. The thing I would change would be the production to sound more polished, but I know the rawness should be left as is for the "noisecore" trend. Plus, it's balanced out by the then-rare-in-metalcore melody, so it's all good either way....

4/5

Coming soon: Another attempt to get on the deathcore trail in the 1997 era...

Another astonishing early metalcore release that I can't believe I didn't discover until today. Here are my thoughts:

Shai Hulud's debut Hearts Once Nourished with Hope and Compassion is an important late 90s metalcore record, and many metal/hardcore bands would be taking the aspect of emotional anger from the music and lyrics of Shai Hulud for their own sound. This band certainly isn't emo, but they have emotional passion in their lyrics and music. Hearts Once Nourished with Hope and Compassion consists of 9 amazing songs with the most intensity heard in the genre. Shai Hulud have been a highly significant part of the metalcore league despite the long 5+ year gap between albums and as many lineup changes as Annihilator. Their debut shows how beautiful hardcore can be. The band's strongest lineup has made their ultimate essential album! Now would it surprise you found out that the vocalist at that time is Chad Gilbert, founding guitarist of pop-punkers New Found Glory? Chad has done amazing vocals in this album, screaming out messages of despair, with thoughts better communicated here than elsewhere. There's also excellent guitar intricacy that would make me say the Owen Wilson "WOW." The perfect devastation comes during the breakdowns in contrast to lightning fast rhythms that sear through. Hearts Once Nourished with Hope and Compassion would be a major influence to the hardcore/metalcore world. Shal Hulud is still as influential as they've ever been these past 25 years. Hardcore/metalcore fans would surely be inspired by one of the most original bands of the genre. This is hardcore perfection!

5/5

Angry heaviness occurs for this band:

Earth Crisis wasn't the only band to add more groove than hardcore into their metalcore, with Vision of Disorder continuing that angry combo in their debut. My thoughts:

With sieges and wars on the rise in different parts of the planet in the 90s, where did some of the witnesses put their rage? In music! Many 90s extreme bands aggressively tackle the world's problems in their sound, whether it's rap metal like Rage Against the Machine, or metalcore like this band Vision of Disorder. This band from Long Island has shaken the world as much as their peers, with the extreme metallic hardcore of their 1996 self-titled debut! Combining melody and heaviness, Vision of Disorder's self-titled debut is another highly essential album of 90s metalcore. The golden age of metal has been considered to be the 80s, but the 90s was in fact the golden age for the earliest metalcore, and this offering is one gem from that era!

5/5

Ben, please add the Hatebreed album Satisfaction Is the Death of Desire. Its Metalcore tag now fits the RYM 2:1 ratio (for: 70 - against: 28).

Ain't this a real heavy deal in early metalcore!

I gave Earth Crisis' first EP and first two albums a listen, and the Firestorm EP and Destroy the Machines are some of the best I've heard so far in this journey, reaching a perfect 5 stars! They're terrific early examples of metalcore, filled with raging riffs and substance-free lyrics. However, their second album Gomorrah's Season Ends has some slight cliches from their attempts to recreate their success. Still it has a great amount of impressive music, continuing this band's status as an important one in metalcore history! Maybe someday I'll keep listening to that band full-time and check out their later albums, but I have other metalcore albums to look out for in my rediscovery saga. I shall continue it with a few other bands with important early albums. More of the original Revolution awaits me!

The most hardcore breakdown of metalcore breakdowns in my opinion occurs in this track:

Cool, thanks Daniel!

Thanks, Daniel!

These two tracks together form the ultimate early Revolution anthem:

I changed my mind. THIS is the birth of metalcore if we count the 1989 demo version:

As a bonus treat before progressing through metalcore's first decade further, I decided to find and listen to Rorschach and Integrity's first ever demos, released in 1989, though Integrity's Harder They Fall demo would be re-released a year later as In Contrast of Sin with two more tracks. They're good but don't reach the greatness as the proper albums. Still I acknowledge the demos as the real birth of metalcore. Here they are:

A mighty mix of pre-Tool alt-metal and mid-paced angry metalcore:

The debut album from a band determined to make a sharp rudimental sound of metallic hardcore and, as a result, sounding ahead of their time! I said that because, it was the year 1992, and they were already introducing new sonic elements into the genre they were helping pioneer. You can hear some alt-metal to remind you of Biohazard, Helmet, and Life of Agony, with a similar approach in the production. Besides often hitting a mid-tempo pace, what's worth noting is the deranged vocals performed by Rennie Resmini; not hardcore, not metal, but in between. With all that said, there's so much to digest, especially for those who have had a hard time finding this album before the reissue. Hope they speed up the pace they've had in releasing albums (3 more in the 30 years after their debut)....

4/5

An important part of 90s hardcore, already signifying the metalcore vision of Earth Crisis and Hatebreed:

What if you can fully establish metalcore as a genre without being highly dependent on hardcore roots, to influence heavier subgenres, a bit like Black Sabbath's way of heavy metal in Masters of Reality? Add that and lyrics of the confusing insanity of life, and you have the violent intensity of Integrity's Those Who Fear Tomorrow! This hardcore juggernaut is the start of the band's over 3-decade legacy. It is one of the first ever metalcore albums, from 1991, though only the second after Rorschach album from a year earlier. It's no secret that Cro-Mags and Corrosion of Conformity where experimenting with crossing metal over into their hardcore, but Integrity helped bring life to a brand new world. Hardcore verses and metallic breakdowns are led by the original metalcore Dwid Hellion! For this album's violent soundscape to work, Dwid was born for this world to unleash his psychotic vocals. This unique approach was for many a complete anomaly. This bizarre delivery was unusual at that time, and somehow it still works greatly, with lyrics tackling every trick in the hardcore book. Those Who Fear Tomorrow is responsible for a metalcore tomorrow....today!

4.5/5

The birth of metalcore:

So now I'm heading into reviewing the earliest conventional metalcore releases, and what better way to start with the first ever release in The Revolution clan:

Here are my thoughts:

The revolutionary history of metalcore all began with this hardcore quintet from New Jersey. If you enjoy the sound developed and popularized by Converge or the recent noise-grind of Nails, Rorschach is the band to thank! Their debut Remain Sedate would bring a rebellious future to mankind. After the decadent 80s when metal and hardcore were two separate sides, the despondent 90s was when both genres have been united. Rorschach has made the perfect stylistic formula for the most brutal hardcore at that time, transcending into a newly invented sound. This is a relentless D-beat-inspired assault of crushing riffs and tormented screams like nothing before! The slithering bass and jackhammering drums share the stage with the guitars and vocals. This raw formation of a new sound while channeling their own horrors is kind of what Black Sabbath had done when inventing heavy metal. Like Sabbath, Rorschach was a will-testing pioneer of their own new genre. With this perfect offering, metalcore was born!

5/5

A 20-minute epic of sludgy mathcore to please fans of Neurosis, Botch, and Cult of Luna:

One last glimpse at mathcore for this journey before the next subgenre, and a step forward into sludge territory. RIP Didier Séverin... Here are my thoughts:

Lots of cool stuff you can find from Switzerland including metal bands Coroner, Samael, and Eluveitie, along with Tolberlone's triangular chocolates and Swiss Army Knives. Initially, the band only gained attention in Europe, but they would then be heard of in America thanks to Hydra Head Records releasing their first two releases. Challenger is an album that would challenger the Northern lands with unexpected expectations from their sludgy mathcore sound! Their songs often range from the mathcore groove of Botch and Coalesce to the ambient sludge of Neurosis and Cult of Luna, all guided by tempo changes, complex drums, and elevating intensity. The intensity has evolved into one of the best albums I've heard of sludgy mathcore. This excellent music with catch your ears with this pummeling record. It should really be picked up by fans of that sound, especially Neurosis, Keelhaul, and Cult of Luna. Add some sludge spice into your metallic hardcore with the perfect challenge that is Challenger!

5/5

Coming soon: A trek through the releases that started it all for The Revolution....

A speedy aggressive (later turned melodic) metal/mathcore ride:

A slight step down compared to the debut albums of those 3 metalcore/mathcore bands (Deadguy, Coalesce, Cave In) but very enjoyable nonetheless. Here are my thoughts:

From the shadows of Rock and Roll Killing Machine, Drowningman brought the right tools for the sound of this second album of theirs in a noisy mix of elements from hardcore punk and crossover thrash that formed metalcore. It is shocking to find the lack of appreciation this band gets for their strength. They even had the audacity to write a few long song titles, but the songs themselves are short and don't have to feel long because of the sharp relentless riffing attack and occasional melody. Rock and Roll Killing Machine reaches near-perfection with its caustic blend of melody and dissonance in the vocals and guitars, creating crazy monstrous hooks for noisy hardcore punk songs to morph with math metal into their own subgenre. Drowningman has proven that it's hard to replicate the Killing Machine that they are!

4.5/5

Deathcore used to be as problematic as death metal for me, but I started liking it more as I was programming the Revolution monthly playlists, with a few bands I've recently discovered having a more standard deathcore sound as opposed to the bands with progressive/symphonic elements that would fit in the STYLISTIC category of my Metalcore Pyramid Guide. Anyway, here's my top 10:

1. Embodyment - Embrace the Eternal (1998)

2. Make Them Suffer - Neverbloom (2012)

3. The Contortionist - Exoplanet (2010)

4. Born Of Osiris - The Discovery (2011)

5. Iwrestledabearonce - Hail Mary (2015)

6. Attila - Outlawed (2011)

7. Upon a Burning Body - Red. White. Green. (2012)

8. Within the Ruins - Elite (2013)

9. Winds of Plague - Decimate the Weak (2008)

10. Veil of Maya - The Common Man's Collapse (2008)

Slayer-riff-powered mathy metalcore. Start headbanging!

I shall continue with a few other bands with albums that are mathcore or helped develop the subgenre...

One band in the latter category, Cable is not yet added to Metal Academy. While I wait, I'll continue on with that category and the rest of the metalcore journey, starting with...

A progressive-ish mathy metalcore masterpiece from a group of talented musicians, including bassist Caleb Scofield who tragically lost his life a few years before today. RIP. Here are my thoughts:

Their debut Until Your Heart Stops shows what a boundary-breaking band they can be and would make you up for many listens. Instead of going as melodic as Killswitch Engage, expected is the violence of changing rhythms you might also hear in The Dillinger Escape Plan, Coalesce, and Converge, the latter's members Kurt Ballou and Jacob Bannon appearing a few times in the album. Many different elements form the uniqueness in Cave In's mighty sound, for a new underground attitude. The songs range from short hardcore tracks with Slayer-inspired riffing, to longer progressive epics, to one-minute noise interludes. The album is an interesting diverse addition to the metalcore revolution. It's the perfect way to start this band's career that would end up taking a less heavy turn. Don't let their legacy stop!

5/5

RIP bassist Caleb Scofield

Ben, please add Cable (also a Fallen band with their sludge metal albums).

I gave the first two Coalesce albums a listen, and Give Them Rope is one of the best I've heard so far in this journey, reaching a perfect 5 stars (the other one of the best being that Deadguy album)! It's a terrific early example of metallic mathcore, highly technical with underground production in a decent album length. However, their shorter second album Functioning on Impatience might be good for the impatient but not for those who want a full album, pretty much like the Daughter's Canada Songs of Coalesce in terms of length and quality. Maybe someday I'll keep listening to that band full-time and check out their last two albums, but I have other mathcore albums to look out for in my rediscovery saga. I shall continue it with a few other bands with albums that are mathcore or helped develop the subgenre...

I'm currently taking on the first two Coalesce albums, and I'm at another perfect start with the destructive Give Them Rope, with pummeling highlights like this one: