Morpheus Kitami's Forum Replies

I've never really listened to much Sepultura. I've listened to most of the albums from the classic period, and while I've liked some, I've never really revisited them. They're certainly one of the oddest groups, going from near death metal to nu metal sellouts is one heck of a career trejectory. I haven't heard anything since Roots or so, but people love these guys again, so clearly they did something right.
What surprised me when I first listened to this album was how much it sounded like modern Testament, which forced me to ask the question, who did it first? I mean, Testament did start off like Metallica before getting heavier, so I took a moment to check. The answer's complex, since I think Testament hit on the exact package first, but vocally they only thing they really stole, as such, was the way the vocals here sounded. It's very clearly an influence, since both are gruff, deep guys who frequently do near growls.
As an album, it's pretty good, feeling like a mix of their best moments. Songs tend to blend more sell-outy parts with harsher bits. Normally, that's not really a combination that I think works, usually the style differences seem awkwardly sewn together. But these guys make it work, which I find amusing since I gave up on them because they were getting crappy because of some elements. Here they blend the two pretty well, sometimes even in the same song. It comes off as unique, like if it weren't them you'd get something incredibly mediocre.
What I was surprised at was the occasional bits of prog leanings that sneak in. Never an entire song or anything, but a strong undercurrent. Even some of the requisite tribal music is thrown in. That said, a lot of times it feels less like a genuine attempt at expanding and more like someone got really into listening to Joe Satriani during the recording of this album. Sometimes it seems like passages are copied note for note.
I ultimately enjoyed this, as the negatives generally seem minor. I daresay this might even end up being my favorite Sepultura album.

4/5

Hi Ben, could we get folk metal/folk rock band Theigns and Thralls added? (they're sort of ambiguous, but the first album is metal enough to be included)

Probably not fitting your Skinny Puppy thing, but Bloodstar fits as an experimental band. Sort of Celtic Frost if they did Industrial Metal kind of thing. (...but bear in mind I'm hardly someone usually listening to Industrial Metal)

I would point out that every description I've seen of stoner rock and metal is that Black Sabbath is one of the primary influences. It's really not that silly that something that was an influence on a genre has a song in that genre. You could also say that Black Sabbath isn't Heavy Metal or Doom Metal either, considering that it took about a decade before those genres got going too.

(and I say this as someone who has absolutely applied strict time definitions to actual scenes like NWOBHM, it ain't the same thing)

The first couple of times I listened to this, I didn't really get much out of it. Do I still like epic doom metal, I thought to myself?
But as I listened to more of the album, it struck me that my problem wasn't me, it was the album. It's not exactly epic doom metal, at least not as I recognize it. It's not epic doom metal, it's doom metal with epic metal attached. It's a doom metal album with a strong Manilla Road influence, and I don't think that combination really works. The crushing, heavy guitars combined with that heroic fantasy feeling is just jarring.
It doesn't help that the four songs on this album don't really do much to distinguish themselves from each other. Without distinguishing themselves, how can they be distinguished against others? Beyond that sense of heaviness, this album doesn't really have much that sticks out in my mind. There are no interesting riffs, heaviness is the point, and the solos are decent enough. The vocalist even just sounds like he's taking after someone else, but not doing it in an interesting way.
While I obviously didn't like the album, I do like that they tried to do something with their music that's just a bit out of left field. I think if they continue in this direction, they should go for something shorter. As contrary as it might seem, the greats used a mix of both short and long songs. Endless epics aren't necessarily better than short songs, and getting your point across in three minutes are as much a skill as making something ten minutes long.

2.5/5

I'm not really sure I have enough thoughts on that aspect of the album to say much about it one way or another. I see parts that are black metal, but I also see parts that are gothic metal.

Novembre is one of those bands I can't actually recall, but sounds like one I've probably encountered in passing. Anathema in the suggested bands on M-A, probably vaguely popular enough that I've seen them without really knowing what it is.
The vocalist and some of the earlier songs really reminded me of the sort of vaguely metal alt rock that seemed to fill pop music during the decade this was released. It's the clean vocalist who really sells it; He's one of those whiny guys who you usually hear singing about another breakup or about how they're really going to do it this time. I think it's a shame because the lyrics are far too good for the guy singing them.
This isn't to say I don't like the album, it's nice, but as a package it's missing something else. It's just...fine. It definitely has that doom metal Pink Floyd vibe that Anathema had, so it isn't that. Despite the album taking a while to get going, even on the second half I get that eh feeling. I'd say the material doesn't quite work with the production it has. That said Swim Seagull in the Sky, even with this lifeless feeling, still works.
With that said, it has been done many different ways, since I'm hearing a remastered version, and even this album is a remake of an earlier album. The question is, did it change because the earlier productions were worse, or because they didn't quite like it and ended up here? I think for now, I'll be content to just wait to answer that question.

3.5/5

I blame Atheist for giving me such high expectations for tech death metal. While there are many good tech death bands, few can match what this album accomplishes; and none can match the elegant simplicity of the intro to Mother Man. In ten seconds we get the bass leading, then a surprisingly simple guitar riff, and finally the focus is on the drums. Each part in harmony, creating a whole that is much more than it seems. It's rare an album that can show exactly how well it works in it's opening notes.
It's not that there isn't anywhere else for the genre to go after hearing this album, it's just that it's hard for anyone to come up with something that doesn't sound worse. Each factor that goes into making a song good, does here. A perfect blend of aggression, technicality and melody. And unlike a lot of guitar solos where it comes down to a case of technicality or artistry, this never comes up here. If I had to complain, I'd say that even after years of extreme metal and having the lyrics, it can be hard to decipher the vocals.
I really don't have much critical thought on this one simply because it was almost everything I wanted out of tech death. What more did I want? Elements.

10/10

What's wrong with the production? Because I've never really considered anything wrong with that.

I don't really think there's anything special about them in that sense. They primarily shift between psych and hard rock, and on this album, I think the hard rock wins out. On the whole there's the third album, but that one does not sound like it was recorded in the '70s, so I can't help but think of it somewhat negatively. Like that one Italian band who did the obvious modern recordings claiming to be some lost '70s metal band. (and IIRC, did have some actual '70s recordings, which didn't sound unusual in this regard)

Sir Lord Baltimore - S/T
If nothing else, Sir Lord Baltimore is not content to sit on their laurels since Kingdom Come. A lot of bands, in so short a time, would release something similar to the last album, but this is not the self-titled, no sir, this is something different. At least for them, in general this sounds more like a typical rock album of the time.
To start with there's the epic Man from Manhattan. It's not bad, but it isn't that interesting either. It strikes me as unfocused, and in some places like a poor copy of Thin Lizzy. (Yes, I know this was before Thin Lizzy, it still sounds like a copy) It's an odd choice to start the album off on.
I have to wonder if Henry Conklin heard either of these albums at some point, because this is the first time I've heard someone like him before he started singing. Maybe this guy was always like that and I only noticed on this album because it's a stronger resemblance.
The album is a lot more approachable. There's still that crazy guitar, but it no longer drowns out everything else to the detriment of the song. Now it's more of one part, though this comes at the cost that some solos feel like there's only there because that's necessary. The non-10 minute tracks are all broadly good. I dig Chicago Lives for it's bizarre proto-Blaze Bayley Iron Maiden sound; Caesar LXXI for being a simplistic but effective predecessor to epic metal.
It's a shame that the band dropped off after this, because I think here they managed to start finding their groove. Alas, outside of a rerecording of old material three decades down the line, this is it for Sir Lord Baltimore.

7/10

Was anything off the new Nasty Savage album ever on a playlist? If not, Schizoid Platform off the new one.

Black Sabbath - Paranoid
Paranoid is more what I expect out of a Black Sabbath album, but still finds ways to be odd in retrospect. The sort of thing that reminds you that this is still really before metal is metal as we know it. We might owe heaviness to Sabbath, but in many ways it just isn't what we expect of metal.
Take War Pigs. There's nothing weird about War Pigs, right? Wrong. No one outside of a progressive or technical band would make anything like War Pigs. Metal bands don't devote sections of their song to short guitar riffs followed by drum fills. The more loose song structure here is far more alien to the average metal song, than say, a comparable hard rock song from a non-metal band.
In this sense, the hero of the album is Bill Ward. He might as well be called Peter, for he is the rock the rest of the band is built around. There might be better technical drummers, but in this moment, there is no drummer more precise than him. No drummer more perfect than him. Without him, songs like Paranoid or Iron Man would still be as heavy, but without him, they would lose that feeling of tightness that they enthralled the world with.
On an album full of hits, I feel like the real best song on the album is Electric Funeral. Keeping the doom metal spirit alive through sound rather than vibes. Takes a lot of skill to make a song with effectively one riff work for 5 minutes. Oh, sure, it has variations, but it's one riff. I guess there's a solo, but it has to be the simplest solo ever made.
Paranoid still remains within the confines of this weird heavy rock that retroactively became heavy metal. I think if anyone else did what this album did you'd see a progressive tag for sure. Which isn't a mark against it, just an observation about how it remains beloved in and out of the metal community.

9/10

That's something we already have. I just had God in the Schizoid Mind as the alternate name for that band. I just changed it to GISM and you can now search for that name on the Bands page.

Isn't that like a joke name they have? IIRC, each album has a new standing for what the name is supposed to stand for. Isn't it like putting We are Sexual Perverts as W.A.S.P.'s alternative name? Hang on... *checks* Did WASP have an alternative name before now? You didn't even put "We Ain't Sure, Pal".

Do you think it would be possible for band AKAs or something to be added? I was looking up G.I.S.M. a few moments ago and typically expect it to show up as just GISM. It's more a mild annoyance with them, I'm sure there are other bands for whom such things can be aggravating or confusing. (I would say Accuser, but that apparently actually works if you don't type the weird symbol?)

Interesting, I didn't realize how much a lot of it is like Jimi Hendrix, since I never really sat down with him, just hearing hits on the radio. That does make their inability to make it big back then, since I think they do have the sensibilities to be looked back fondly on by the same audience who usually listens to classic rock radio.

Back in the day I used to think quite highly of this album compared to it's predecessors and successors. I can't see why now. Gone is the power part of the equation that was so great about Oceanborn, yet it doesn't quite embrace the more fully symphonic sound that the Olzon-era would become. Instead, it's just sort of awkwardly sitting in '00s chug.
I daresay that if it was someone else who made this album, it would be a lot more controversial at best, outright hated at worst. (In the metal world, anyway) I Wish I Had an Angel, in particular, you could just slap into any dance club mix and it would fit perfectly; Right down to the sexy lyrics which are far more dark than they are on the surface. I can't rightly put my finger on why I like it compared to something like Evanesence.
Which isn't to say I dislike the album. I think the first four songs (including I Wish I Had an Angel, that's just an observation) are possibly the best Nightwish have ever done. Dark Chest of Wonders is a good opener, oddly structured. The chorus is incidental to sweeping instrumental sections, only appearing twice. The use of a choir singing sharp, short notes is odd, but I don't listen to enough opera to know if that's truly as odd as it appears to me. It really strikes a good balance between symphonic and metal, reminding me why Nightwish still kind of is the top of the roost when it comes to the sub-genre.
But then we get Creek Mary's Blood, which starts off Nightwish's trend of long, overwrought and pretentious self-indulgence. Stopping everything for an important message, though the Trail of Tears is less pretentious than 15 minutes of "it sucks being Toumas Holopainen". Nightwish's grand symphonic sound clashes with the depressing nature the lyrics invoke of people being torn from their ancestral land. It's not that it's a bad subject for a song, Satan and Running Wild did the same broad subject, I just don't think Nightwish can do effectively a funeral dirge about it.
I wouldn't say songs after this get bad or anything, but they definitely suffer coming after this song. Doubly so on extended versions of the album. By the time Ghost Love Score is over, I'm about done with the album, yet on the version I listened to, there were still five more songs. Even with just two more songs on the normal version of the album, that's a lot to go through.
Lyrically, it's a lot of cheesy, sentimental self-loathing from a Finnish man with a questionable grasp of English, and I love it. There is a subtleness, that perhaps I'm imagining, to the package, that you can't get solely by hearing the album or reading the lyrics. This comes out most strongly in Planet Hell, in which one line is supposed to be "you wanderer", but Tarja clearly sings "you murderer". Considering the content of the lyrics otherwise, I'd be surprised if that was accidental.
In the end, I still stand by my original thought that this sits awkwardly between better albums, even if it has really strong elements to it. I can see why someone else would think of this as their favorite.

4/5

Sir Lord Baltimore - Kingdom Come
Of those early metal albums, on casual listens Sir Lord Baltimore was an odd duck. It always seemed to me to be just as firmly in the genre as Black Sabbath, yet it's presence was far less talked about than arguably less important bands like Deep Purple and Rush.
Paying attention to things this time, I can kind of see the reason now. I think occasionally we metalheads forget that non-metal (and non-punk) bands can be frantic and aggressive too. This isn't to say there aren't metal tracks, but it's not a hidden, undiscovered metal band from the '70s. Not really helped by it feeling like a lot of songs were done by different bands.
I'm going to say something I'm shocked I would say, but the franticness of the album works against it. The guitar never stops doing something new, but oddly, the vocals feel far more like a backing element to the guitar dancing around. It's like the vocalist is the backing track to a never-ending guitar solo. Which in theory I don't have an objection to, except that I usually don't listen to the sort of psychedelic hard rock this is, and thus to my ears it can frequently turn into noise. A lot of these tracks would just be better without vocals. Not because they're bad, but because vocals are ill-fitting for the sound the band is usually going for.
Aiding this impression is that most songs have a similar structure, BPM, and lyrical content. It wears when very song can be summed up with, doodooduldedo, WOMAN, doodoodolololo, LEEEEEEEEEEEFT ME, lululhudoo! It's telling that the song that has always been on my mind is the title track. The song finally lets every element breathe. But I suppose it shows why they did what they did. You can make their songs into a three minute piece going incredibly fast, or you can bring it out to six minutes. I guess in theory they can't win.
In the end, this album feels like a monkey's paw. Occasionally I'll think the backing bits during the vocal parts of another band's song will be boring, but this album shows exactly why they do it that way.

3/5

Isn't there some way for forum software to automatically make a thumbnail of an image that's too big? I don't know how it works on this forum, but I've seen it on other forums.

People tend to divide manga from comics, but there have been some metal related manga over the years. Often moreso related or referencing the genre than western counterparts. (Dunno about most Eurocomics though) Detroit Metal City is a comedy series about a guy who was somehow forced into a black metal band despite being into poppy singer/songwriter stuff. I have no idea if most of the stuff it references is based off something real, but a lot of it just works off simply off reputation. Yeah, you'd believe a metal band would think up this goofy gimmick for themselves or some sort of crazy event. There's also Bastard, which has a lot of references, and generally fits the whole dark fantasy vibe a lot of metal goes for. I didn't read it yet, so I can't tell you the specifics.

I will say that if you haven't, you should watch Heavy Metal 2000, it's just a good, well-made movie. It'd work even if it wasn't based off a story in the comics, with all the licensed music.

Oh, it wasn't specifically about metal. Oh, well. I like the usual stuff, haven't read nearly as much as I'd like. Some just haven't gotten around to, others are in languages I can't read. I'd like to read more Dylan Dog, that Italian horror comic series which is massive over there, but thanks to a looser view on copyright, hasn't really been done well in English circles. My Japanese is getting good though, so soon I think I'll pay for Amazon Japan's Kindle Unlimited and see what wonders untranslated '70s manga has in store for me. Back to stuff I've actually read, I'd suggest Astro City if you haven't read it. It plays out like the culmination of the superhero comic, sort of the philosophy of the whole genre. Because it isn't tied into a particular universe it's more free to do what it wants, but doesn't abuse that freedom to make something screwy.

Surprise.

Black Sabbath - S/T (1970)

Let's see if I can say something unique about this one. Probably not. I've been trying to get back into playing the guitar, which I generally can't make as intelligent observations about my own skill or lackthereof outside of stuff like "how the fuck do you play that chord?" or "made that note high-pitched". Every skill from guitar to language learning has observations you can make as an amateur and observations you can only make if you actually know what you're doing.
This applies here in that there are two albums called Black Sabbath. The Black Sabbath we all have in our head that's heavier than everything released until 1982, which is really just the first song, and then the other Black Sabbath, which has that and then far more psychedelic music flow throughout it. I don't need to explain the former album, even if you haven't listened to Black Sabbath its the exact thing you have in your head from reputation or the album cover, it's the latter that needs explaining. The album minus the title track.
While the album is very heavy for 1970 it is not so out of place for the most part. Other bands occasionally reached the heaviness on one or more tracks an album. Basically every single distinct song on this album is at least a bit metal. The key word is distinct song. There is a lot of more jam session-esque pieces on the album bridging songs. Not Dream Theater, more Grateful Dead. An almost ambient backing, carrying the dark mood far more than most metal bands would do afterwards.
In this regard, no one imitating the band has gotten close to them. It's very easy to imitate the heavy sound these guys had, but it's another to imitate the whole package. To start off with something that sounds like it should be playing over the apocalyptic wastes before switching to a heavier version of '60s bluesy rock instrumental. To not make it sound forced or obviously distinct, but for it to just be. Not their doom metal imitators, nor their occult rock imitators. Even my personal candidate for the band carrying on the original Sabbath spirit, Ningen Isu, only ever get as far as imitating most of their elements. If metal is defined as imitating Sabbath, metal has failed.
This is back in the days when Ozzy still sounded weird and alien, rather than a coked out methhead behind a 7/11. You get some strange contrasts. On The Wizard, despite sounding dark and depressing, comes off as oddly upbeat which by all accounts should come off as deeply sarcastic. Especially since the album ends with a song in which he laments about a love he never had. It's one of those things that happens because this is the era where a band doing X genre absolutely must do so and so lyrically.
Sabbath's debut is just as unique now as it was originally. Did it invent heavy metal? Basically, but it's not just that, and that's why 50 years down the line it's worth listening to even as probably millions have imitated it in some way.

9/10

Being one of the heaviest things in the early 70s counts for a lot in that regard.

I don't see why it counts for anything at all to tell you the truth. We're comparing these releases to the modern-day understanding of what metal is. Not what it was back then when it was still yet to be defined.

It does for a lot of people....a point you already acknowledged when you said we had differing opinions. Heavy is very much a factor for some people in a genre called heavy metal. Some people don't consider power metal to be metal because of that. Further, for the most part, in the early '70s you basically have them and Sabbath as your big (generally accepted) options, they sound fairly similar to each other and quite different from the sounds of even their immediate successors. People generally work off what they know, and if it quacks like a duck...

I'm not talking about why Budgie were linked to metal back in the early 1970's. I'm referring to why they continue to be linked to metal today, despite not possessing the required attributes to warrant it, while others with stronger claims don't receive the same privilege. I'd suggest that it's almost certainly the Metallica link. Besides, it's been clear for a while now that you & I are working off different criteria when judging a release's metal credentials.

So was I. Being one of the heaviest things in the early 70s counts for a lot in that regard. How many albums have we come to the conclusion that despite being listed as metal have less metal than Budgie? We don't really need an much of an explanation for why the heavy rock band who sounds very similar to Sabbath in 1970 is considered to be metal today. If there are any other bands that do something similar, you can feel free to include them here.

Sorry I haven't been posting anything this past week, Christmas was busy and then my computer went all funky, not that we need much on Sabbath anyway.

Hi, Ben, could you add:

The newest Don't Drop the Sword

Solitary Sabred

Diamonds Hadder

Tower Hill

Drugstore Woman/Bottled, blues rock.

Young is a World, opening/outro is prog, while I'd say the in-between bit is hard rock/heavy metal.

Stranded, hard rock with bits of metal here and there.

This result is really cementing my long-time feeling that Budgie would never have been linked to metal if not for the links to Metallica who've covered a number of their tracks over the years.

(side note, can we get a quote function in the reply box? It's annoying to have to quote the whole message to have to quote one particular bit)

I don't think that's true in the slightest. What made Budgie get linked to metal is how they were the heaviest thing in 1970 outside of Sabbath themselves. There have been bands who have gotten linked to early metal for far less material than Budgie did.

Also, unless there's a pretty massive difference, I think it's safe to remove live albums from the running.

I don't see any reason to argue on those two tracks. (well, more like not caring about the specifics of something that isn't rock on the former...)

M-A has them as pop rock for a period, it might very well be most of their '70-s albums.

Rocking Man, this one's another very hard to define song, but I'm going to go with hard rock/heavy metal.

Rolling Home Again, acoustic I guess.

There's enough metal in the rest to put it to 40%.

Anyway, Whiskey River is a hard one to put my finger on, it seems like a mix of about 4 different genres despite being such a simple thing.

That one seems to me to be hard rock/heavy metal, not just a hard rock song.

That puts me at 3 out of 8, which I guess is ambiguous enough to go either way.

Unquestionably hard rock.

Future Shock, I'd say doom/heavy, reminds me of a track I can't quite remember from a decidedly not metal band.

I like being able to get those bonus tracks, so as long as the changes aren't too bad I don't mind too much. Funnily enough, despite the obsession with vinyl, the only reason why that escaped the loudness wars is that you just can't do that to a vinyl record. Early CD presses are usually good about that sort of thing too. Funny how the superior format ends up being worse because companies insist of being shitty.

Isn't that Megadeth album kind of weird? Some versions have a censored version of the Nancy Sinatra cover, others lack it entirely.  The former practically turned it into a gag song.

Come with Me, hard rock I'd say.

Our Home, feels like something off a band like Kansas, not quite sure where, but prog rock.

Curiously Pink Floyd-ish, not metal.

I hear nothing that would put it as anything but hard rock.

A straight mix in my opinion of both.

Come Down, prog rock.

Blind, very Led Zeppelin-ish, not metal.

Nightmare, uh, same as Blind, maybe a little bit of metal.

Don't Start Flying, rock of some kind.

I guess I got 1.8 or so tracks as metal. Not really metal.

My suggestions for the next playlist:
Lord Vigo - Eternal Saviour (off Blackbourne Souls)
Ningen-Isu - 鬼  (off 修羅囃子)

The Ningen-Isu album is in The Guardians and not The Fallen, so I cannot accept that suggestion, Morpheus, but the Lord Vigo has been added.

Hasn't this argument already happened? It's a Fallen track from a generally Fallen band.

My suggestions for the next playlist:
Lord Vigo - Eternal Saviour (off Blackbourne Souls)
Ningen-Isu - 鬼  (off 修羅囃子)

I'd say both get my vote for heavy metal.

Heavy psych gets my vote.

Pretty sure most, if not all Deep Purple albums after this point are just hard rock. I know Rex said differently about Perfect Strangers, but that's no longer The Roots of Metal.

Deceased's seemingly legendary concept album based on Romero's zombie movies, as they existed in the late '90s. The dead walk the Earth again, killing and eating everyone they can get their hands on. Something that humanity would easily be able to bounce back from if we could stop arguing about pointless crap for 5 minutes.
These guys are not the kind of band who should make long concept albums. Firstly, we get several interludes which add nothing to the music. I'm not really sure there IS an album improved by some dude talking for 2 minutes in the middle of it. Further, I'm not really sure that what death metal was missing was songs with about 8 riffs going on for 8 minutes. There's a very tedious aspect to this album because of it. Growly choruses that go on forever are not my favorite thing in the world.
While the album gets a lot better as it goes on, I can't help but think of this album as not knowing what it wants to do. The band jumps all over the place from drop and gritty death metal to Maiden-worship with some growls. There's some good stuff in here, but I got some serious tonal whiplash at times.
Speaking of tonal whiplash, the lyrics. These get weird. It's not quite the full tonal whiplash Romero's films would eventually get with zombies are actually the good guys, but it is out there. It goes through the expected arc of a zombie story, fleeing from zombies, fighting them, and eventually scientists trying to figure out how to cure it...and then the protagonist gets bitten and dies in Unhuman Drama. The final two songs involve him becoming part of some kind of zombie hive mind. It's a trip.
I'm not really sure how I feel about the album in the end. It's very all over the place.

3/5

SubRosa is an old favorite band of mine. I don't know how I found them, but I found the whole whole female-fronted sludge/stoner metal with violins idea a lot more intriguing than I normally would. While they used the violins on their debut album, it was far more sparingly than they would use starting here.
They really sought to make this album as crushingly heavy and depressing as possible. Usually when one thinks of metal and violins, one thinks of the later providing some contrast. Not so here, here it's just another element adding to the sorrow. There's a very on-edge effect the violins add. Without it, the band would be quite mundane, with it, a tension atypical of such bands.
While I like the EP, it's only after trying to figure out what the albums before and after it have that this lacks that I figured out what was missing. Two of the three tracks were remade for the follow-up, No Help for the Mighty Ones, and those versions of the songs are just better in every way.

3.5/5

This one's probably a coincidence, because Europeans were more Amiga kids, but this masterpiece (D'pahk if the link doesn't work right) from the Ironseed soundtrack:

And Ayreon - Comatose:

I agree with hard rock.

I'd say hard/prog rock. Kind of hard to just be prog rock when the track is under 3 minutes IMHO. Gets a bit metal at times but too scattered in what it does to truly be metal.

Er...I said yes in the post just above you.

This one gets stoner metal. Once again I think we're agreed this one is unanimously metal, unsurprising really. It'll be interesting to see when we're agreed that something other than Sabbath is metal.

How about this one, coincidence or plagiarism? Or judging by what one of my friends said when I showed them this, non-existent?

The pianos on this...

...and the flute/fiddle on this? It's a somewhat deep cut, but it wouldn't be unreasonable for Toumas to listen to darkwave.

An amusing little song consisting of nothing but Duke Nukem references. (just the one I timestamped at 5:00, not the rest)