ZeroSymbolic7188

I went back to Gorguts and did my thing. I don't know if you will like the thing, but I thinged my ass off.

Hi, Zero. Just read your review and although I may not have put it quiite so bluntly, I actually agree with your view of excessively technical metal. I am over sixty and have been a metalhead since I was 14, so remember all too well when metal was treated with contempt by fans of other styles of music for being simplistic and dumb, so it rubs me up the wrong way too when some devotees of technical and complex metal look down on fans of "simpler" forms (ie metal with actual songs). It's bad enough when outsiders do it, but it feels like a betrayal when so-called metal brothers do it. But Ben was right, your new review has given everyone a far better insight into who you are and where you're coming from than the original one-liner. For the record, I thought Gorguts' first two albums were pretty good, but when they ditched the songs for a purely technical form of expression on the highly-rated Obscura they completely lost me.

As a massive fan of funeral doom metal and judging by some of your comments so far regarding it, I suppose we won't always see eye to eye, but it's good to meet you and I hope you enjoy your time here. Welcome.

Thank you so much man. That truly means a lot to me. I just didn't know if my brand of negative review would be well received. I've had the misfortune of being around moderation elsewhere (looking at you Reddit) that would chalk up any kind of negativity as toxic trolling, so I had learned to reel myself in. I was genuinely concerned that I was gonna wake up banned this morning. 

I absolutely love funeral doom, I just prefer the "pretty" stuff with the violins and keys as opposed to the oppressive wall of sound synthesizer approach. 

You're welcome, ZS. Obviously I can't speak for Daniel and Ben, but as long as things remain respectful to other site members, there has never been any problem with posting negative reviews. We can't all like everything and in the great wide world of metal there will be things that wind us up. For example, I recall you said you liked Type O Negative, but they are a band I just cannot get along with, the whole theatrical gothic schtick in certain styles of doom metal being a particular bugbear of mine.

As far as funeral doom and drone go, I have said it before on the site, I sometimes struggle with auditory overload, but I find the monolithic nature of FD and Drone extremely calming. Progressive electronic like Tangerine Dream has a similar effect on me, but the unadulterated volume of doom metal suits my needs better. This is also probably why I am not a fan of excessively chaotic avant-garde and technical metal. Anyway, whether we agree or disagree, I hope we are all able to get along together and I look forward to reading more of your stuff as it's nice to have new points of view.

Dan and Ben seam like damn cool dudes. I know now not to worry about it. I'll probably go back and try to add more bulk to my more lean reviews-not gonna lie sometimes its a real chore, but we'll get it done.

About Type O- I love that whole late 90s'-2000's Gothic Aesthetic. Something about being in formative years, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, and Alison Hannigan (Willow). I just love everything about that. It's thick in their work and if you don't like it you probably aren't going to like Type-O, the 69 Eyes, Moonspell, etc. There is just no getting around it with those bands. 

However, if you have not heard "I Don't wanna be me" I would throw that your way. It still has Type-O all over it, but it's a shorter song with a punk rock composition rather than the lengthy slow material you would often associate with them. 

How do you feel about Danzig? 

I feel you on the low sounds. Good doom is like a warm blanket. I will have to look into Tangerine Dream-I'm intrigued. 

When it comes to the technical stuff I don't immediately hate it. I would say Tomb of the Mutilated is a fairly technical album, but it still has recognizable strong structure and hooks and I love that album. 

I don't like things like Brain Drill or Periphery where the whole stick is "look at how goddamn good I am at this instrument." I can play in those styles, and I've done it in the past, but I'd much rather listen to Cronos growl and smack his bass and play like a demon. 

Dan and Ben seam like damn cool dudes. I know now not to worry about it. I'll probably go back and try to add more bulk to my more lean reviews-not gonna lie sometimes its a real chore, but we'll get it done.

About Type O- I love that whole late 90s'-2000's Gothic Aesthetic. Something about being in formative years, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, and Alison Hannigan (Willow). I just love everything about that. It's thick in their work and if you don't like it you probably aren't going to like Type-O, the 69 Eyes, Moonspell, etc. There is just no getting around it with those bands. 

However, if you have not heard "I Don't wanna be me" I would throw that your way. It still has Type-O all over it, but it's a shorter song with a punk rock composition rather than the lengthy slow material you would often associate with them. 

How do you feel about Danzig? 

I feel you on the low sounds. Good doom is like a warm blanket. I will have to look into Tangerine Dream-I'm intrigued. 

When it comes to the technical stuff I don't immediately hate it. I would say Tomb of the Mutilated is a fairly technical album, but it still has recognizable strong structure and hooks and I love that album. 

I don't like things like Brain Drill or Periphery where the whole stick is "look at how goddamn good I am at this instrument." I can play in those styles, and I've done it in the past, but I'd much rather listen to Cronos growl and smack his bass and play like a demon. 

Likewise, I don't hate all technical metal out of hand, but I do like to be able to hear an actual "song" under the technicality. Atheist, Nile, Death etc. are all fantastic and several of my five star albums are by these bands.

I'm not massively into Danzig either, although I did love The Misfits when Glenn Danzig was in the band. The Type O track I do like (and I really like it) is Creepy Green Light, so if there's anything else like that then I may be interested. Even My Dying Bride sometimes piss me off, but they have a lot more great stuff than not, so they are forgiven their innate "gothicness", similarly with Paradise Lost. A band I really love who are in similar vein, but with female singers, are SubRosa. Somehow female singing in gothic metal annoys me less, I think it's because they aren't doing the whole "listen how deep and vampirey my voice can go" thing - and I do love violins in metal.

If you do look into Tangerine Dream then try their 1970's stuff first, Rubycon, Ricochet, Stratosfear and such are far better than their later, more movie soundtrack-sounding stuff, for me anyway.

Edit: Just checked out "I Don't wanna be me" and guess what, I liked it. It sounds a bit like early Sisters of Mercy - yes, I actually love gothic rock, but not gothic metal so much - go figure. I'm also very keen on old-school punk rock and hardcore, so the punky feel to this is actually right up my street. So now I like two TON tracks - we're really getting somewhere!

If you have not heard "I Don't wanna be me" I would throw that your way. It still has Type-O all over it, but it's a shorter song with a punk rock composition rather than the lengthy slow material you would often associate with them.

Just checked out "I Don't wanna be me" and guess what, I liked it. It sounds a bit like early Sisters of Mercy - yes, I actually love gothic rock, but not gothic metal so much - go figure. I'm also very keen on old-school punk rock and hardcore, so the punky feel to this is actually right up my street. So now I like two TON tracks - we're really getting somewhere!

Although I haven't really listened to Type O Negative for a few years, I still enjoy that track. "I Don't Wanna Be Me" is one of their most upbeat tracks, as opposed to their usual slow gothic doom, and one of my favorite bands Trivium made a cover of that song.

I also really enjoy the Sisters of Mercy, Drive around the abandoned industrial areas of Detroit in the early morning listening to Dominion/Mother Russia. Is a real treat. This Corrosion and Vision Thing are great tracks too. 

The Misfits fucking rule, and always have. I even like the controversial Michael Graves stuff. 

Female Vocals-This is going to ruffle feathers, but I almost always hate it. It's not a "boys club" or "woman hater" thing either. My problems with it are:
1) I simply don't like high clean vocals. Black Metal shrieks are fine, though I do much prefer death metal guttorals and baritones. I don't like high-tenor male singers usually either.
2) A lot of times that singer is the whole focus of the band. You have an otherwise unremarkable/generic sounding band, but "classically trained operatic soprano" so now it's better?
3) These bands tend to attract non-metal fans. "Yeah I like Nightwish, because Tarja Turunen is beautiful and such a great singer, but I hate metal." I've heard that so many times that I've gone bitter. 
4) Evanessence was a war crime against music. 

That being said. Female-fronted bands I do like and recommend.

Savage Master-Stacy Savage: Sonically they sit right between Judas Priest and Slayer. They have an awesome stage show that features Stacey looking very cool and commanding, backed by a lot of big dudes in executioners hoods. It plays wonderfully on stage. "Ripper in Black", "With Whips and Chains", "Queen Satan", and "Looking for a Sacrifice" are all stellar. I see this band every single time they come to town. Stacy is a national treasure.

The Runaways-Joan Jett and Lita Ford-... two words "Cherry Bomb"

Girlschool-Do you like Motorhead? Ever wonder would it would be like if they were an all female unit? Girlschool answers all your questions. They have one album, but it's great. "Race with the Devil"

In this Moment-Maria Brink. This band was white-hot a couple of years back, and then they took some time off. If I remember properly the time off was because Maria was with child. They are back on tour now, just released an Album Called "GODMODE" which I've sampled. It seams alright but you want to go listen to BLOOD for their best stuff. "Blood", "Sick Like Me", "Adrenalize", "Whore"

There are more but that's off my head right now.

I'd also like to draw some attention to Liz Buckingham, Jo Bench, and Lena Abe. These ladies are not the front people for their bands, but they excellent musicians none-the-less that bring unique talents to their respective bands; Electric Wizard, Bolt Thrower, and My Dying Bride.

Glad you enjoyed that select track from Type O. My favorite Type O song is "Pyretta Blaze" because it starts off sounding a lot like Black Sabbath's "Into the Void" and then transitions to very nearly pop chorus. I enjoy those things about Pete's song writing. Since you liked the punkier offering, you might check out Carnivore. Pete fronted Carnivore prior to forming Type O. The content is New York Hardcore Punk with um... "interesting" lyrical choices. 

If you have not heard "I Don't wanna be me" I would throw that your way. It still has Type-O all over it, but it's a shorter song with a punk rock composition rather than the lengthy slow material you would often associate with them.

Just checked out "I Don't wanna be me" and guess what, I liked it. It sounds a bit like early Sisters of Mercy - yes, I actually love gothic rock, but not gothic metal so much - go figure. I'm also very keen on old-school punk rock and hardcore, so the punky feel to this is actually right up my street. So now I like two TON tracks - we're really getting somewhere!

Although I haven't really listened to Type O Negative for a few years, I still enjoy that track. "I Don't Wanna Be Me" is one of their most upbeat tracks, as opposed to their usual slow gothic doom, and one of my favorite bands Trivium made a cover of that song.

I need to listen to more Trivium. "A Gunshot to the Head of Tribulation" is such a kickass song that I've recently appreciated. The lyrics are really awesome and empowering. 

I kind of agree with your views on the symphonic metal bands, but SubRosa are very much not in that style. They are far doomier than any of those symphonic bands. Check out More Constant Than the Gods.

I think doom metal is very inclusive for women, with loads of bands having female members and not just vocalists, but even when they are singers, the likes of Windhand's Dorthia Cotrrell and Acid King's Lori S. are nothing like Tarja and co.

I grew up with The Runaways and have several of their albums on vinyl from the time. Girlschool I saw a million times during the NWOBHM era - they were on tour almost constantly and were tons better live than on record.

I do quite like Savage Master - have you listened to Smoulder, they are similar, but maybe more epic doom leaning.

I kind of agree with your views on the symphonic metal bands, but SubRosa are very much not in that style. They are far doomier than any of those symphonic bands. Check out More Constant Than the Gods.

I think doom metal is very inclusive for women, with loads of bands having female members and not just vocalists, but even when they are singers, the likes of Windhand's Dorthia Cotrrell and Acid King's Lori S. are nothing like Tarja and co.

I grew up with The Runaways and have several of their albums on vinyl from the time. Girlschool I saw a million times during the NWOBHM era - they were on tour almost constantly and were tons better live than on record.

I do quite like Savage Master - have you listened to Smoulder, they are similar, but maybe more epic doom leaning.

We I get done with my homework-writing reviews for clans I will come back and listen to SubRosa and Smolder. Windhand is pretty good, and I forgot to mention Jex Thoth. I tried to get into Acid King many many times, and I just don't click with it.

If you have not heard "I Don't wanna be me" I would throw that your way. It still has Type-O all over it, but it's a shorter song with a punk rock composition rather than the lengthy slow material you would often associate with them.

Just checked out "I Don't wanna be me" and guess what, I liked it. It sounds a bit like early Sisters of Mercy - yes, I actually love gothic rock, but not gothic metal so much - go figure. I'm also very keen on old-school punk rock and hardcore, so the punky feel to this is actually right up my street. So now I like two TON tracks - we're really getting somewhere!

Although I haven't really listened to Type O Negative for a few years, I still enjoy that track. "I Don't Wanna Be Me" is one of their most upbeat tracks, as opposed to their usual slow gothic doom, and one of my favorite bands Trivium made a cover of that song.

I need to listen to more Trivium. "A Gunshot to the Head of Tribulation" is such a kickass song that I've recently appreciated. The lyrics are really awesome and empowering. 

If you'd like to start your Trivium journey, my personal recommendation to you is the album In Waves.

If you have not heard "I Don't wanna be me" I would throw that your way. It still has Type-O all over it, but it's a shorter song with a punk rock composition rather than the lengthy slow material you would often associate with them.

Just checked out "I Don't wanna be me" and guess what, I liked it. It sounds a bit like early Sisters of Mercy - yes, I actually love gothic rock, but not gothic metal so much - go figure. I'm also very keen on old-school punk rock and hardcore, so the punky feel to this is actually right up my street. So now I like two TON tracks - we're really getting somewhere!

Although I haven't really listened to Type O Negative for a few years, I still enjoy that track. "I Don't Wanna Be Me" is one of their most upbeat tracks, as opposed to their usual slow gothic doom, and one of my favorite bands Trivium made a cover of that song.

I need to listen to more Trivium. "A Gunshot to the Head of Tribulation" is such a kickass song that I've recently appreciated. The lyrics are really awesome and empowering. 

If you'd like to start your Trivium journey, my personal recommendation to you is the album In Waves.

Just out of curiosity, do you plan on doing an additional clan challenge for a 4th clan later on? If so, which one of the remaining clans do you think suits you the best?

I absolutely do, and to be honest I'm not sure what that fourth one would be.  Lets see;

1. The Fallen-Easily my first choice as I am a massive doom head.

2. The Horde-My love for Old School Death Metal runs deep.

3. The North-I like Black Metal, but I LOVE DSBM, which seams to be neglected on this site-not a single clan challenge features the likes of Nocturnal Depression, Xasthur, Lifelover, or Silencer

So that leaves us with: 

The Pit-There is a lot of good thrash and power groove out there, there is also a lot of mediocre and bad shit in there.
The Gateway-I don't exactly love the stuff in there, but I'm a school teacher and my students love that stuff. It might be a worthwhile pursuit to relate better to them.
The Infinite-It would certainly be interesting, but I fear a lot of pretentious drawn out technicality for it's own sake kind of stuff. Yucky.
The  Revolution-I only really like the absolute heaviest bands this has to offer. 
The Guardians-The neutral/default choice. I love traditional and classic metal, but I hate Power and goddamned Symphonic Metal with every fiber of my being-it might be fun to tee off on that stuff though.
The Sphere-This is the smallest clan on site right now, but it is my wife's absolute favorite music, so I hear it when she's calling the shots. I don't always like it, but it's always interesting. 

Probably between the Pit, The Sphere, and The Guardians. Care to try to steer me?

I have taken a quick look at your ratings. If you'd like to stick with the genres you're already familiar with, then it's a tie between The Pit and The Guardians. If you'd like to try something different and follow your wife's footsteps, The Sphere is a good option. I used to not like industrial metal, but then I found a lot of interesting stuff from that genre as well, and it eventually became one of my current favorite genres and made The Sphere part of my current clan lineup. So you might have some good potential there.

I saw you name checked Silencer there, Zero. Now that is a divisive album. Personally I love it, but I have seen a lot of hate for it elsewhere (it actually rates pretty well here). It definitely contains one of the all-time outstanding vocal performances (as in, it stands out). I'm not the biggest fan of DSBM as I have spent too long on Bandcamp listening to third-rate bedroom acts, but Silencer and Shining (if you count them as DSBM) are excellent. Any more recommendations for top quality albums in the genre?

Deathcade from Nocturnal Depression is in my opinion the best Depressive Black Metal offering of all time. Hell It's my favorite black metal album of all time. That's where I would point you Sonny. It's a compilation of their best songs but re-recorded with better production. Lifelovers' Pulver is pretty damn good too.

Silencer is indeed polarizing, I'm not even a huge fan of it myself, but I recognize it as a major album within the subgenre. 

Deathcade from Nocturnal Depression is in my opinion the best Depressive Black Metal offering of all time. Hell It's my favorite black metal album of all time. That's where I would point you Sunny. It's a compilation of their best songs but re-recorded with better production. Lifelovers' Pulver is pretty damn good too.

Silencer is indeed polarizing, I'm not even a huge fan of it myself, but I recognize it as a major album within the subgenre. 

Thanks, man. I'll check them out.

Been checking out Deathcade this morning and, although I need more time with it, I'm liking what I'm hearing. Some really nice melancholy melodies and a vocalist who at times sounds genuinely in despair. Thanks for the rec, Zero.

Been checking out Deathcade this morning and, although I need more time with it, I'm liking what I'm hearing. Some really nice melancholy melodies and a vocalist who at times sounds genuinely in despair. Thanks for the rec, Zero.

Glad to hear you are enjoying it. They also have pretty high quality live footage out there on youtube. I came across an album in the 1st decade black metal challenge list titles "Vampires of Black Imperial Blood" by Mutilation. It's allegedly the pre-cursor to the DSBM genre, and I think it's an absolute masterpiece. However the production values may very well be the worst that you have ever heard so it might not be your cup of tea. I'd still absolutely urge you to check that out.

Been checking out Deathcade this morning and, although I need more time with it, I'm liking what I'm hearing. Some really nice melancholy melodies and a vocalist who at times sounds genuinely in despair. Thanks for the rec, Zero.

Glad to hear you are enjoying it. They also have pretty high quality live footage out there on youtube. I came across an album in the 1st decade black metal challenge list titles "Vampires of Black Imperial Blood" by Mutilation. It's allegedly the pre-cursor to the DSBM genre, and I think it's an absolute masterpiece. However the production values may very well be the worst that you have ever heard so it might not be your cup of tea. I'd still absolutely urge you to check that out.

I am well familiar with "Vampires of Black Imperial Blood" - I have it on CD and it is one of my 5/5s. I have no problem with lo-fi / zero-value production, in fact, as far as black metal goes I love it. I listen to my fair share of early metal demos, so production isn't a deal-breaker for me if the material is strong enough.

That's what's up Sonny. I'm so excited to get to the SubRosa stuff. I just have to knock out 5 more albums tonight... after mowing. I SHALL NOT SLEEP TILL IT HAS BEEN DONE!