Gator's Forum Replies

Wifey and I like Industrial music which uses heavy sound bites/sampling and sounds like power tools.

My hatred for symphony, power metal in general, and opera soprano are well documented.... however.

I love this and you should check it out:

LOL I like most of those things Karl. 

Hello Sonny, Ben & Andi, it's a pleasure to meet you.

Zachary, you'll be pleased to hear that I gave The Call of the Wretched Sea a spin and I must say, I dig it quite a bit. Since I'm new to the band (and fairly new to funeral doom in general), it's going to take a fair amount of time & subsequent listens before I fully wrap my head around it. That said, I'm genuinely impressed with how cohesively they managed to execute the theme and the lyrics are top tier. What's more, I can already say that I have two personal highlights: The Sermon (when he goes My song forever shall record that terrible, that joyful hour... - man, shivers down my spine!) & Ahab's Oath (this one is soul-crushingly heavy and i really like the synth parts here). Curious to hear which one is your favorite.

It's one of my all time favorites, and I am glad that you enjoyed it!

Here is my review: https://metal.academy/reviews/34371/6530

No no, I mean I've literally fully developed one, it's not metal-specific or anything I just in general need it to be tested, and I remembered somebody had talked about TTRPG design (you). I was suggesting that if you had a table to try it with you might give it a go.

Manual
Factions
Character Sheet
Starter Kit Adventure
Skills and Talents

Thanks for the warm welcome fellas!

I'm looking through all these fresh threads on the forums. Compiling a list of heavy metal deal breakers? - this is exactly the kind of stuff I'm looking forward to.

Also, Hall of Judgement ? Man I like the idea. And I like the name even more.

did... did you say AHOY? Do you like nautical things?

• I'll never miss an opportunity to see a museum ship, if there is one in town I'm visiting.
• Whenever I travel by ship (which is not often, sadly) I feel nothing but a deep sense of joy and calmness.
  
• My dream vacation: From Europe to the States by sea (perhaps on a cargo vessel since these "hotel cruises" are certainly not my thing); and back the same way after a month or so.
  
• This one might be controversial - i have nothing against pirate metal!
  

One may conclude that I have a soft spot for nautical things  :-)

Good afternoon from Detroit MI. Karl. My name is Zachary, and I joined fairly recently. The site is pretty good but it does have a lot of moving parts, so if you need anything feel free to post questions right here, or DM me. Alternatively, the site is owned and adminstrated by brothers Ben and Daniel. Dan is usually a bit more forward, whilst Ben operates in a lower key behind the scenes. Sonny, Shadow, Rex, and Unhindered are all seasoned users. My wife (Kosie) and my guitarist (Max) are also members. Please enjoy yourself. 

\m/ 

did... did you say AHOY? Do you like nautical things?

Cannibal Corpse - Tomb of the Mutilated (1992)

Whilst listening to Tomb of the Mutilated this morning a revelation hit me. The reason I was so belated getting into death metal was the fact that the very first DM band I encountered was Cannibal Corpse (possibly even this album, I don't remember) and I made the error of believing them to be typical of death metal in general. So what, I hear you say. Well the simple fact is that I find CC to be incredibly boring and so took very little interest in death metal generally after that. The vocals are a dull monotone that exhibit no emotional context and although they are capable of throwing out the odd decent riff, they seem incapable of sustaining it for any length of time. Then there is the band's whole extreme gore and horror perspective. Like slasher movies they don't repel or cause me moral outrage, they just bore me because they have no connection to my life or thoughts and so are rendered completely meaningless. I understand that it may just have been a way of baiting the PMRC and the Moral Majority, which, if it is the case, I wholeheartedly endorse, but, I'm sorry, that's just not enough for me. The drumming is good, I'll give them that, but outside the odd riff that briefly hits the spot I can quite happily live out my life never listening to Tomb of the Mutilated again.

2.5/5

You make me sad good Sir, you make me sad. Seriously? "Hammer Smashed Face" riffs do nothing for you? Poor creature! 

With that out the way, I would encourage you to take a second shot at CC with "Eaten Back to Life" it is their debut and in my opinion most catchy album. If "Skull Full of Maggots" doesn't move you then you can dismiss CC.

I need no pity, unless I have to listen to this again!

Love it lol. \m/

Cannibal Corpse - Tomb of the Mutilated (1992)

Whilst listening to Tomb of the Mutilated this morning a revelation hit me. The reason I was so belated getting into death metal was the fact that the very first DM band I encountered was Cannibal Corpse (possibly even this album, I don't remember) and I made the error of believing them to be typical of death metal in general. So what, I hear you say. Well the simple fact is that I find CC to be incredibly boring and so took very little interest in death metal generally after that. The vocals are a dull monotone that exhibit no emotional context and although they are capable of throwing out the odd decent riff, they seem incapable of sustaining it for any length of time. Then there is the band's whole extreme gore and horror perspective. Like slasher movies they don't repel or cause me moral outrage, they just bore me because they have no connection to my life or thoughts and so are rendered completely meaningless. I understand that it may just have been a way of baiting the PMRC and the Moral Majority, which, if it is the case, I wholeheartedly endorse, but, I'm sorry, that's just not enough for me. The drumming is good, I'll give them that, but outside the odd riff that briefly hits the spot I can quite happily live out my life never listening to Tomb of the Mutilated again.

2.5/5

You make me sad good Sir, you make me sad. Seriously? "Hammer Smashed Face" riffs do nothing for you? Poor creature! 

With that out the way, I would encourage you to take a second shot at CC with "Eaten Back to Life" it is their debut and in my opinion most catchy album. If "Skull Full of Maggots" doesn't move you then you can dismiss CC.

My take on it is up. Didn't blow my mind, but was quite solid, above average even. https://metal.academy/reviews/34617/5352

On to Blood Stained Endurance... and pass. I love Catherine but the dude vocals just suck so hard.

So anyway I tracked down Lucid Fear: 

Now the band is better, but Catherine is worse. DAMN.

I'm Blasting In Waves right now. First album of Summer as school's out.

-I need to listen to "In Waves" I think you suggested that to me.

-I am aware of the vocal acrobatics of Will Ramos. I just don't care tremendously for the music that surrounds him. I do respect his talents though.

-I gave sincere consideration to Trail of Tears, because her voice is extremely captivating, but I was sad to see that she hasn't done any other bands. I'd love to see her in something a little more hefty.

I will have to give this a bit of thought, but one thing I do love is lyrics about history - especially WWI or WW2, but shit like Maiden's Alexander the Great is great too (although I do avoid the power metal historical epics).

Oh, and singers with gnarly, grizzled voices like Lemmy or Wino.

The cavernous sound of old-school death metal in the vein of Autopsy. The deeper in the earth it seems to emanate from, the more I love it.

*Bolt Thrower, Weedeater, Cryptopsy. BTW Autopsy bass tone on severed survival is fucking awesome!

Vocals play a massive part in music for me and are probably the thing most likely to get me hitting the off button, so:

1. Shouty hardcore-style vocals where the singer sounds like a three-year old throwing a tantrum in Tesco.

2. Power metal vocals where the singer thinks Bruce Dickinson is OK, but is far too restrained in his delivery.

3. Gothicy vocals where the singer wants you to believe that he really is a romantically melancholy vampire rather than some sad act in a leather trenchcoat. Chances are Andrew Eldritch has already done this ten times better.

4. Overtly technical or avant-garde stuff that exists to illustrate how superior the musician is to us plebs either intellectually or technically.

5. Excessive use of keyboards smeared over the music like too-thick marzipan on a nice cake.

There's probably more, but these are the ones that really twist my melon (man!).

-but if you don't allow shouty bro vocals how will you ever be inspired by Hatebreed (a guilty pleasure for me, I know it's degenerate as fuck but it's great for working out).
-I started laughing my ass off reading the Bruce Dickenson line. Pure gold, and I'm with you on the take. 
-Gothicy vocals where the singer wants you to believe he is a romantic melancholy vampire? I love him, he is me! We turn it on and play VtM:Bloodlines 2. You can send all that shit to my DMs.
-Agree on the Tech for Techs Sake
-Keyboards bad, Violin good. You really just need one Violin. 

Hidden tracks are NEVER a good idea. Thankfully they were related to the length of CDs, so hopefully are gone now.

I rarely ever enjoy cover tracks, unless they match the feel of the rest of the album. On that note, I dislike tracks that have a really different production to the rest of the album too.

Plus Daniel's right that cowbells have no place in metal.

I must say Zero, your hatred for female vocals or non-metal instrumentals seems very passionate. I really enjoy both of those elements if they're done well.

I like cover tracks if the band did them; things like Trouble doing Tales of Brave Ulysess, or Anthrax's take on Cowboy Song. I absolutely hate that youtube "what if this song that has no business being heavy was heavy? What if this super heavy song was acoustic" bullshit, but a real cover is alright. 
I don't hate female vocals I champion Stacey Savage, Maria Brink, and Angela Gassow all the time. I am also  a fan of Thunder Mother, Jex Toth, and Psychedlic Witchcraft. What I hate is that soft chanty opera soprano stuff. I swear there is a free usage sound bite that these bands put in there because they all do it. I think I have PTSD from growing up with that goddamn Titanic theme song. Seriously, scared me for life it did! 
Yes, I hate non-metal in my metal. Imagine that.

Punky one-two drum beats shit me. So does the use of cow bell, particularly when used in conjunction with groovy stoner metal riffs. Any sort of cheese sees me tapping out too i.e. a lot of European power metal.

So, no Powerwolf for Daniel. I'm with you on the power-cheese, yet I like ManOwaR, go figure.

I can't be the only member of this whole site that has these. What am I talking about? Deal breakers, Bad Omens, and Empending Doom (not the fun kind). The shit that makes you tap out, turn the dial, give ya the ick as the kids say.

LOL. I almost thought you were going to rant about two of my favorite Revolution bands there.

I'm going to start compiling a list. Here's what I got. Keep in mind we all have them, these are just mine. 

1) "Airy" female soprano... she's not in the band, it's a backing track. The same backing track every band that does this shit uses.

2) Track on the METAL album has no METAL elements. This shit pisses me off, I grew up very poor, deep in the country, in the bible belt. Getting Metal was a once a year oppourtunity. You just spent $20 on an album. The album has 9 tracks. One of them is a 3-5minute string and piano piece. BRINGS MY PISS TO A BOIL!

"Im going through changes..." Yeah Ozzy I wish you'd change to some shit I paid to hear. Tony Iommi is in your band. He's a pretty fuckin' good guitar player. Let him play it!

3) Beauty and the Beast Vocals-"Airy" female Soprano's evil twin. He says GRRRRR, she says "Ah--ahh-ah". Zero says fuck this shit.

Based on those three, symphonic metal will definitely never be the metal genre for you, Zach. I used to enjoy symphonic metal a lot 10 years ago, but then I started tapping out in favor of heavier, more modern metal genres. Still I enjoy some bands with symphonic elements. One of those bands is Trail of Tears which also has those 3 pet peeves of yours; female soprano (Helena Iren Michaelsen/Cathrine Paulsen/Ailyn), Beauty and the Beast vocals (when Ronny Thorsen growls alongside the female soprano), and a track with no metal elements (e.g. "Illusion?" from Disclosure in Red, "Countdown to Ruin" from Profoundemonium). The only album from that band that doesn't have any of your pet peeves and I would recommend to you is their fully metal male vocal-only 2005 album Free Fall Into Fear. Everything else from that band, NOT IN YOUR HOUSE.

Anyway, I have a few deal-breaking metal genres to show that my expanding taste in metal has limits:

The majority of black metal - I tend to avoid the Satanic bands of the genre and definitely the neo-Nazi NSBM. Though I've enjoyed some black metal bands before that never relied on Satanism for the most part.

Brutal/slam death metal - I'm not really into the gory violence of those two subgenres and some of the more notable bands of standard death metal. Though I still enjoy subgenres like melodic/symphonic/progressive death metal.

The more brutal deathcore bands - Same issue as brutal/slam death metal. Though just like death metal, I like bands that are more melodic/symphonic/progressive.

Drone/funeral doom - So slow, long, and depressing that it's hard for me to pay attention nor resist speeding up the tempo to 2x.

Grindcore - The total opposite of drone/funeral doom, fast and short, but that's also an issue for me, along with a lot of bands of that genre having highly offensive lyrics and band names (such as A.C.). I definitely say no to subgenres like goregrind/pornogrind. In fact, I've listened to and reviewed a few releases by grindcore bands (F*** the Facts, Gigantic Brain, Bologna Violenta, and PainKiller's debut), and they're a few of the only releases in which I've given each of them a rating of less than two stars. I pretty much had a similar "knock it after trying it" attitude to your half-star reviews when writing this one, Zach (keep in mind that almost every other review I've made that's currently up is much more positive and less rage-filled than this): https://metal.academy/reviews/28695/3144

I'll try them out. Fuck it. Why not? Yeah it's like sonic torture, but I actually like her voice. Her voice is pretty awesome-it's a little lower than what I'm talking about and it has a little bit of rasp on it which I dig, but the music and the male vocals-no thank you Sir. If she sings in a heavier band I would absolutely try that out.

-Black Metal that is all Satan all the time is usually all suck all the time. -AGREED
-I love Slam, it's turn your brain off music, the stupider the better. Bananaslama rules, Max and I want them to come play near us. I also dig Krocophile out of Lansing (go see their album cover for Slamzilla-the Return it's peak!)
-We gonna disagree about melo-death/brutal death. I'm on the opposite side of the tracks there.
-I don't get Drone, but really good funeral doom is just awesome, cathartic even.
-Grincore. I like it either in the completely fuck off variety (Anal Cunt), or the serious as a car crash variety (Brutal Truth). Brutal Truth-Extreme Conditions Demand Extreme Responses is a must listen. Spin that. That Fuck the Facts stuff was awful your review of it is accurate as fuck.

Vocals that you can't understand. Cookie monster vocals. If I can't understand you then I assume you are not proud of what you say and it's not worth me hearing.
Down tuned extended range guitars. It's not the guitars but how these types of bands use them. The tone has become so generic and bland. Every production sounds the same.
Too much X -- IE: To many pinch harmonics, to many bends, to many notes.
Djent - Ther is no redeeming qualities to this genre.
Overly complicated leaps and jumps across the fretboard for the sake of seeming complex.
Thin flat drums / the overuse of cymbals
Dirty piss poor production. 

We've talked about this, and you knwo where I stand on all of it lol. long story short, mostly agree, but I love Fear Factory. Dino Cazarez can have as many strings and tune as low as he wants. Let him cook!

.. and with all that I think I'm caught up.

You ever heard Masters Hammer- Ritual?

it’s Czech Heavy Metal. One of the jewels in the first decade black metal list (good shit Dan+Ben)

Vocals that you can't understand. Cookie monster vocals. If I can't understand you then I assume you are not proud of what you say and it's not worth me hearing.

How about lyrics in a language you don't speak?

i personally think foreign language stuff is cool, but I do like having an English translation if it’s real good.

i know max super well, I’m not speaking for him, but he’s enjoyed non-English before. I think it has to do with diction. Even if it’s a foreign language he likes to hear clearly where words end and begin. Doesn’t like a guttoral that sounds like one rolling utterance.

Today is an exams day so I’m on hall duty and stuck on my phone. We’re gonna have some fun in here when I get home.

Hidden tracks are NEVER a good idea. Thankfully they were related to the length of CDs, so hopefully are gone now.

I rarely ever enjoy cover tracks, unless they match the feel of the rest of the album. On that note, I dislike tracks that have a really different production to the rest of the album too.

Plus Daniel's right that cowbells have no place in metal.

I must say Zero, your hatred for female vocals or non-metal instrumentals seems very passionate. I really enjoy both of those elements if they're done well.

i like them if they are done well and with conviction. Funeral doom has some of the most beautiful stuff out there with the symphonic. I also don’t hate women, I’m talking about a particular type of backing vocal that sounds like free-ware. 

Welcome to the Academy Max! (I fuckin' love this guy). 

Rehearsal space for pop-rock band,

and now TrencH is official: https://trenchoctopus.bandcamp.com/track/scratch-track-1

Jam Space for Jam Band. 

...and when I'm wrong I'm wrong. I'm also honest. Big Frank says Hard Rock (wifey reached out to him):  Well done Daniel!
*handshake*

Battle jackets look awesome, but all I can afford is band T-shirts.

Go to a thrift store, and get a cheap denim jacket. Then you order the patches seperately and sew them in. Patches are mostly cheap except for rare and tour patches. Authentic Bolt Thrower patches are very expensive and sought after.

It's got a bit of a psychedelic Velvet Underground/Lou Reed meets Americana feel to it. I like it. Well done mate.

Thank you Sir! I very much like Lou Reed, especially the Transformer Album! Glad you enjoyed it. I have more if you ever want it I can hook you up, but we don't sound like this all the time. I want to do this project this summer as TrencH. Just need to get the songs I've written tightened up and find me a metal drummer who doesn't want to play at 400bpm's lol

I got a bunch of T-Shirts too of course. Two closets and two drawers full of em. Rockin Obituary: Slowly we Rot T at the moment. Never owned a Motorcycle, you can only make use of em about 2 months of the year up here, and even then Detroit Drivers and Pot Holes!? Brother, I love my life lol.

That story about your old jacket sounds fuckin awesome though and I'd love to see that shit!

I'm familair with it. I've even weighed in on all the stuff I feel knowledgable enough to vote on. I'll give a lot more to that dynamic when we have 15 regularly activce members. Still, if I have 1st-hand access to an artist, as I do in the case, I will always differ to the artist over any online website, journalistic publication, or popular opinion.

Fair enough. I'm going to side with the artist themselves as the ultimate authority of their own music.

Well, yes there's a couple of metal tracks on the Bang album but I don't think the record as a whole qualifies as metal. It sits much more comfortably under hard rock for mine.

You probably just need to go back and relisten to it a couple of times. Give it time to soak in, also consider the time- 1972. Consider it's contemporaries, outside of Black Sabbath. I saw them live on October 25. 2014 at the Pyramid Scheme in Grand Rapids Michigan. They shared the stage with Radio Moscow and Pentragram. They were damn heavy that night I can tell ya that!

From Bang's Wiki: The group was formed by drummer Tony Diorio, bassist/singer Frank Ferrara, and guitarist Frank Gilcken and released three albums on Capitol Records, scoring one minor hit single with "Questions", which reached number 90 on the Billboard Hot 100.[4] They were strongly influenced by Black Sabbath,[5] and are considered forerunners to the doom metal genre.[6]

And here it is from the horses Mouth 
https://www.bangmusic.com/Story.html
"Back in the spring of 1972, heavy rock trio Bang were shaping up to be the proverbial Next Big Thing. Having signed a few months earlier to Capitol (home, of course, to the Beatles and the Beach Boys), the band’s first single, ‘Questions’, was nestling proudly in the Billboard Hot 100. With the enthusiastic support of their record label, their debut album, Bang, was also climbing the charts. Moreover, they had recently opened for their idols, Black Sabbath, and, by common consensus of opinion, stolen the show. With two band members, guitarist Frankie Gilcken and lead singer/bassist Frank Ferrara, still in their teens, Bang seemed to be unstoppable.

Somehow, though, it didn’t quite work out. Even as ‘Questions’ was charting, changes at Capitol saw the band’s supporters moving on, replaced by A&R men who had their own signings to promote. With the band’s producer also leaving the label, Bang’s support system crumbled. Their new producer engineered a change in personnel that left the band’s drummer and lyricist, Tony Diorio, out in the cold, while Capitol insisted that Bang develop a more mainstream, pop-oriented sound. They changed management companies, only to discover that they were being blackballed, leaving gigs hard to come by. By 1974 - just a couple of years after their initial success - a tired and disillusioned Bang had long since lost their direction, momentum and self-belief, and they went their separate ways."

Their idols were Black Sabbath, and they switched Management over lightening their sound. I'd say that's pretty Metal. Want me to ask Frank how he feels about it?


Here's what they got up to last year: 

The self-titled album from Philadelphia trio Bang was released in February 1972 & opened with this number that sits somewhere between heavy metal & hard rock:

Bang! is metal enough to open for Pentagram and  hold there ground. Frank Ferrara (Bass and vocals) is the salt of the earth and will talk to you on facebook if you reach out to him. All in on Metal here if you need it cemented check out the doomy offerings on the track "Last Will and Testament" or consider the odds of anything as dark as "The Queen" getting classic rock airplay-not a chance. Killer album

1st off. This thing fucks! 5/5 track!

For me everything about that riff and guitar tone are metal. It uses the Phyrigian mode of the major scale which can be though of as a minor scale with a flat 2nd. It's often chosen for it's threatening characteristic (think the Jaws theme).  Kicks ass! OHHHHH SCOTLAND WHAT A BEAUTIFUL TRACK!

Juniors Eyes is a tough song to classify. It's definitely not Metal though. The best thing about the track is Geezer's rolling bassline. 

I would like to Nominate SLAM band Krocophile to be added. 
 The album art alone is perfect, and you get very good Slam too! Additionally I reached out to the guys and they were excellent to talk to and do business with. Please consider Lansing Michigan's own KROCOPHILE-SLAMZILLA: THE RETURNING

and I got My Dying Bride on there shortly after the above was taken, a big one that goes under the Nocturnal Depression Patch in Red Font. 

So cool, Zero!

Thank you brother.

"4. We've already stated numerous times that we have no intention of making the changes you're requesting."
This is the first time you have outright stated this. I promise you that starting now I will not make any more suggestions. I do very much like the site in it's current configuration, I just saw more. If you don't want to pursue more that is fine by me. I even said as much earlier in this thread. I am available to you if I can be helpful in any way, but I will not bring my ideas to the table going forward-only if explicitly asked by you or Ben to do so. I only respond to this item, because it renders responding to any of the others a mute point.

Today's song is Black Sabbath's "Johnny Blade" which is close enough to heavy metal in my opinion:

Johnny Blade man.... It's kind a of bloated and mediocre song, but it contains one of my all time favorite Tony Iommi Riffs. If I remember correctly from "I am Ozzy" the Autobiography; Iommi was getting heavily into Queen  and was wanting Sabbath to adapt more of the exploratory elements Queen was doing at the time-it's even more prominant on Technical Ecstacy. Still I would call Johnny Blade a Metal entry if not the heaviest thing in the world.

If you want to go the academic route then let's work together to create courses with lesson plans, rubrics, and tests, and if you pass the test you get the certification. That would accomplish everything you say you want to do, and if somebody is able to pass 9 courses, then they can get the nine clans. Set standards and award the people who are willing to meet them. You clearly have expectations about what you want from site membership. Put it down in concrete terms, and let's make an academy then. I've been an educator for 15 years and counting, I have all kinds of free time this summer. If you want to create and academy then let's create an academy.

A multipotentialite is someone with many interests and creative pursuits. Although multipotentialite is a modern term, the idea of someone with many passions is not new. Any student of history often hears mention of polymaths or Renaissance people. Multipotentialites have, indeed, existed as long as human societies.

"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, and die gallantly. Specialization is for insects."

— Robert A. Heinlein, Time Enough for Love

Thank you. I keep it ever growing. I periodically go through and prune it too. Please do enjoy. 

Doing well up here in the Mitten (Michigan USA). I work as a high school building substitute teacher. This means that I work to fill vacancies in just one specific building, rather than a traveling substitute, it's kind of an ideal niche I found myself in. I have the stability and priveleges of a standard teacher but not nearly as much take-home responsibilty so I'm freed up to play in bands and write about metal with all you lovely people. 
We are nearing the end of the school year for summer, just 3 days to go. Summer plans include getting central air and heat installed and updating the electrical outlets in the home, as well as remodeling the kitchen. There might be a trip down to Florida for a small vacation somewhere in there.
Musically, I'm working with a long time friend on a pop-rock project, jamming in a second group that does standard blues and classic rock, and then working on my own project-a nautical themed black metal project with my saxophone playing friend-called TrencH. 
Life is good, I have a beautiful supportive wife, a good ol hounddog, a 5.7L V8 equipped Dodge Ram 4X4, and a Gene Simmons signature (G2) Gibson Thunderbird with my trusty Orange big combo amp... so all my basic needs are comfortably met. 
Concert-wise I am looking forward to local groups Chain Ripper and Flood the Desert in July. Big name act In this Moment in August and the next day a local slam band called Krocophile that have the best album cover of all time. Probably gonna add some patches to the ol battle vest in there too. 
The challenge is to lose weight but I've hired a personal trainer and dietician, so I think we drop another 20-30 before school fires back up in the fall. 

I think this is what it boils down to. You work through things at a more deliberate pace than I do, and I respect that, all I really want from you is mutual respect. Not everyone is the same, we don't have to be. If you have comment or concern about a review I have written, then respond to the review and I'll address whatever you bring to the table. If you have personal things to sort with me hit the DMs. I do not wish to cloud up the forums with this sort of thing-it's not the place.

Just to clarify, Zero, you don't have to complete any challenges before you rate or review other releases as the clan challenges are completely optional. Members can completely ignore the challenges if they wish, although at this stage, it is the only way to unlock a fourth clan. I only unlocked my own fourth clan late last year and I have been here since 2019!!

I do understand what you are saying about the fixed nature of the clan challenges though. I have always myself quietly favoured a set number of reviews for a clan, whether it be 20, 25, 30 or whatever, but on whichever releases the user chooses themselves.

That's what I'm saying. If you want the best from people you need to empower them to make choices. Like I am trying my damnest to squeeze something of value into some of these modern era Death metal reviews, but sucks is sucks, and mediocrity is worse.

That's what's up Sonny. I'm so excited to get to the SubRosa stuff. I just have to knock out 5 more albums tonight... after mowing. I SHALL NOT SLEEP TILL IT HAS BEEN DONE!

Review limit per "x" period would be my idea for submission.  How many members actually read the reviews that have been made since their last visit?  I know if I log in and there's a couple since my last visit (usually once a day as a minimum) I will take the time to leaf through what has been written to see if there's anything to pique my interest.  When I log in and the visible list is off the page and it is by the same member (and I have been that member at some point I am sure) I just leave the words to the sands of time or for someone with more patience than me to read through them.

Whilst I accept that reviews are a core part of MA there is a danger of them not really holding much influence if they are permitted to be shoved out like some conveyor belt-style operation.  I think established members are sensible about this (although not without exception either) and so it may be something to consider if the site does get busier with the additional marketing that is happening.  I think it makes the site look less active to some degree.  Personally, I have looked at many forums and thought "one person is posting here based on the last active threads" and gone off elsewhere.

Still of course nothing to stop the same problem if you have say a max of 4 reviews every 24 huors and nobody else posts once the member who last did their max returns with a fresh quota.  Still think it needs some control however.

If this becomes a thing. I will leave. 

Not seeing a negative.

I suppose such a visceral reaction deserves reasoning. I probably wouldn't leave at this stage of the game-I only have 5 albums to go.  Since the original suggestion is on a different page I'm reposting it here for easy reference.

"Review limit per "x" period would be my idea for submission. How many members actually read the reviews that have been made since their last visit? I know if I log in and there's a couple since my last visit (usually once a day as a minimum) I will take the time to leaf through what has been written to see if there's anything to pique my interest. When I log in and the visible list is off the page and it is by the same member (and I have been that member at some point I am sure) I just leave the words to the sands of time or for someone with more patience than me to read through them.

Whilst I accept that reviews are a core part of MA there is a danger of them not really holding much influence if they are permitted to be shoved out like some conveyor belt-style operation. I think established members are sensible about this (although not without exception either) and so it may be something to consider if the site does get busier with the additional marketing that is happening. I think it makes the site look less active to some degree. Personally, I have looked at many forums and thought "one person is posting here based on the last active threads" and gone off elsewhere.

Still of course nothing to stop the same problem if you have say a max of 4 reviews every 24 huors and nobody else posts once the member who last did their max returns with a fresh quota. Still think it needs some control however.

Let's not sugar coat it, this is aimed at me and any other future members would churn out rapid reviews, conveyor belt style. I don't perceive it as an attack, it's a reasonable and genuine concern. So I will now put forth my counter argument:

The feature that sets this apart and makes it so appealing from other options is the clan system, and I personally believe the potential of that system has barely been scratched. The idea of belonging to and unlocking clans is supremely attractive.  To Unlock a 4th clan as things are right now, you are going to need to do 75 reviews. You have limited autonomy in the selections, and it is mandatory that you review every album. Now, an album is roughly an hour long, so this is 75hours of someone's time. Most people where I live work a 40hour week, so to put it into to perspective this is 2 weeks of a full time job just to hear every track. Add the time to write the sort of in-depth review that is clearly desired, even though there is no rubric, rules, or template in place to cultivate it, and you might even double that amount of time. I am blessed to have that sort of recreational time, because I am financially well-off and my job does not run through the summer time. Most people are not in that position, most people are struggling tremendously-I was among that walk of life until about 2 years ago. Even as it is you're looking at about a months time to do this if you really want people to sit down and listen to each and every single track. 

I have a couple of things that I benefit from in this endeavor; I have much more free time than most people, I have been a Metalhead for coming up on 2 decades, and I am the kind of person that reads walls of books on the subject, and had sought out most of the landmark albums of the major sub-genres. I save a lot of time because I have deep familiarity with most of the list albums going into the project. For example in the first decade of black metal list, their are 25 albums. I am already intimately familiar with 19 of them before I start. Even with these advantages its a grind. I'm trying to power through them to get to what I really came here for-Hang out with fellow metalheads, and listen to things I haven't heard before. 

What your suggesting would make this process take even longer. You want people to write quality reviews, and to interact with reviews others put forth? I agree that would be ideal, but work comes before pleasure. Let them get the homework out of the way as quickly as possible so that they can go play with you. Do the math  on this. 75 reviews at 4 per 24 hours. 75/4- would take 18 days assuming you were able to do 4 every single day. 

It isn't my style to complain without offering some solutions of my own; I'm not trying to tell Dan and Ben how to run their site-it's their time, money, and effort. It's their baby. I am just solution oriented here.

I propose reworking of the clan system and taking an all or nothing approach:

You either pick just 1 clan and lock that in-ensuring that it is a careful decision and each clan has the most devoted members (talking to Dan about this privately this seams like the desired result), and you need to do 25 reviews that adhere to some kind of clan acquisition rubric that we would develop in order to get it. 

or

You open it wide from the get go and let people choose between having anywhere from 1 clan designation all the way up to all 9. The benefits of doing that is that you give users autonomy right from the start and we get to move right into having a good time-and people reading the review would know if it's coming from an all-arounder type source, or if it's coming from a die-hard of that particular sub-genre. I obviously gravitate toward this idea, but I'm self-aware enough to know I'm in the minority with this perspective. 

or

You leave it as is it, and accept it for better or worse, but what I would absolutely not do is demand more time from people.

People do not like being told what they have to do, especially people who belong to a counter-culture. If you came to this site and were met with an assignment: You must write 75 reviews of albums you do not get to select and you must do it a way that satisfies every other user on the site. Would you agree to do this?

Been checking out Deathcade this morning and, although I need more time with it, I'm liking what I'm hearing. Some really nice melancholy melodies and a vocalist who at times sounds genuinely in despair. Thanks for the rec, Zero.

Glad to hear you are enjoying it. They also have pretty high quality live footage out there on youtube. I came across an album in the 1st decade black metal challenge list titles "Vampires of Black Imperial Blood" by Mutilation. It's allegedly the pre-cursor to the DSBM genre, and I think it's an absolute masterpiece. However the production values may very well be the worst that you have ever heard so it might not be your cup of tea. I'd still absolutely urge you to check that out.

Here's a concept I quickly threw together for a Fallen-specific shading to start with, using one of my previous posts.

Good shit Rex! 

That’s not a bad idea actually. I like the idea of giving each clan its own feel. We’d have to have the cost vs reward investigated though as anything that’s done to the site comes with a price tag.

On the Discord/chat topic, I think we might need a much bigger pool of active members to make it worthwhile. Unless you think it could be a draw card to bring people to the site? Are there other live chat resources that are metal-specific?

There should either be a free service available or something fairly cheap. I've coded themes many moons ago and it was not difficult or time consuming. You just linked the image you wanted for background into a line of code, and then turned the font to it's HTML Color Code: https://www.computerhope.com/htmcolor.htm

That's assuming HTML is still how these things get coded though... MANY MANY MOONS ago.

Forum Themes

Right now every Forum page looks the same, It would be cool if their were forum themes so that each clan board had a diferent look and feel. Alternatively you could offer users a drop down to select a theme for the whole site. 

Members of specific clans should discuss which aesthetics must be represented first before settling on a layout.  We'll need a thread for this, though.

I was thinking just do a big watermark of the clan logo. Maybe change the color of the text to match the color of the logo? Start simple like that and tweak from there.

Forum Themes

Right now every Forum page looks the same, It would be cool if their were forum themes so that each clan board had a diferent look and feel. Alternatively you could offer users a drop down to select a theme for the whole site.