Daniel's Forum Replies

Loving this beast of a post-sludge B-side from Converge's "I Can Tell You About Pain" single from 2017. Why in the actual fuck wasn't this track on the "The Dusk in Us" album??

Converge - "I Can Tell You About Pain" E.P. (2017)

This short two-track single from the Massachusetts-based metalcore kings' ninth album "The Dusk in Us" is an absolute belter, mainly due to the inclusion of the seven-&-a-half minute post-sludge epic "Eve" which is some of the band's best material. The two-&-a-half minute title track is a short burst of mathy hardcore that's pretty fun to bop along to but it's certainly overshadowed by the beast of a B-side with its tribal drumming & tense atmosphere.

For fans of Isis, Trenches & The Dillinger Escape Plan.

4.5/5

Take bands like Exciter.  Each song is basically an attempt at being a fast and energetic hard rock song, which is basically the most generic form you can takes. 

I have to admit that I disagree. Exciter always had a few slower heavy metal tracks included (at least on their first three records which are ones I'm most familiar with) & those were usually the ones I liked best as I generally find heavy metal to be more appealing than speed metal. I always found Exciter to be a combination of Venom, Motorhead & Black Sabbath & albums like "Violence & Force" & "Long Live The Loud" offer almost as much heavy metal as they do speed metal in my opinion.

Besides, we already have one clan taking five genres, I don't think we need another.

I'm pretty sure that was a consideration when we originally made the call actually Rexorcist although it has to be said that The Guardians includes Neoclassical Metal which pretty clearly isn't a genre in my opinion & is probably in need of sorting out more urgently than speed metal does. Speed metal is possibly the most poorly used genre tag in all of metal in my opinion with even some of the most popular releases in the whole genre being simply mistags. The first two Venom records are prime examples of this as neither include more than a couple of speed metal tracks each. You'll often find speed metal used simply as a logical descriptor to cover releases that really include 50% thrash metal & 50% heavy metal tracks when there aren't really any genuine speed metal tracks included on the release. Even genuine speed metal records aren't consistent across the whole tracklistings as there's a need for variety of tempo so they'll inevitably have a couple of slower tracks included that fall into heavy metal territory & that muddies the water a bit. To me there's a fundamental difference between speed metal & thrash metal in that thrash is driven by the riffs which is why they're usually more complex in order to command the audience's focus. Speed metal is driven by the vocals which sees the riffs & song structures being simpler & more of an accompaniment to the vocal or lead guitar melodies like they are in heavy metal. The links between speed metal & European power metal definitely give The Guardians a strong case but if you look at many of the top speed metal releases you'll find that plenty are also tagged with thrash so I could honestly go either way on this. Perhaps Andi is right & it needs a detailed deep dive to come up with an informed decision.

Ben & I gave this a lot of thought before deciding on our current arrangement when we were originally building the clan philosophy. We opted for the current arrangement because in our experience speed metal had a stronger stylistic crossover with thrash metal. I'm certainly open to revisiting this but are interested in everyone's feelings. I'd really like everyone to be aware that RYM is a very poor guide though so we have no intention of blindly following what they're doing.

My prediction is that they'll take the cash-grab option of every other old-school band that's reformed in the last decade i.e. they'll steer clear of the "Grin" sound as it was too divisive.

It must be four years since Coroner first made it public that they were working on new material. They're really taking their time here, aren't they?

I'm certainly very interested to see what they come up with. I actually prefer their 90's material over their 80's albums so I hope it's a continuation of the development we saw from each progressive release to date.

I've always quite liked "Into The Dark Past". It kinda sits in that grey area between thrash metal & speed metal, doesn't it? I find the quality of the tracklisting to be a bit inconsistent (particularly on the B side) but the highlights are strong enough to overcome the weaker material in my opinion. I've got it at 3.5/5 personally.

Apologies Rexorcist. I didn't mean to offend. I just didn't see a correlation to the Hall entry in your post above so assumed there was a misunderstanding of some sort. I guess I also have an inherent bias towards this particular Hall entry as I can't for the life of me see how Fleshgod Apocalypse & Apocalyptica hold the same audience but if you're telling me that they do then that's my bad. You have every right to vote in whichever way you see fit & it's really none of my business. That's what the clan system is here for after all i.e. to stop whinging ol' death metal obsessives from having a say in what happens with melodic metal genres that they have no genuine interest in.

I didn't hear any guitars on "The Ashes of Light" at all to be honest. If they were there they must have been so far back in the mix that I couldn't pick them up. The programmed drums were nothing out of the ordinary for New Age music as far as I could see so I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.

Rexorcist, if you read the notes on that Hall entry you'll find that it was never in question that "Agony" is a Symphonic Death Metal album. The Hall entry was really about whether a record like "Agony" should reasonably sit in our heavy/power/symphonic/neoclassical metal clan alongside the likes of Nightwish, Within Temptation & Epica (not to mention Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, Helloween & Blind Guardian) or not.

I'm gonna stop you right there at "these vocals can only be found on a black metal release."  Music progresses by combining elements from various influences, so even though I haven't heard this album, it seems clear that that just makes this album an unconventional ambient album.  I am very curious, hover, what albums you're thinking of when you say "better new age releases."

If you read my full analysis of the album I think you'll find that we're actually in agreement Rexorcist as I've ultimately voted to remove "The Ashes of Light" from any Black Metal related links but I'm not sure how you can make any sort of judgement without having heard the release in question. I think the correct tagging for this release in RYM terms would be a primary of New Age & a secondary of Black Ambient. To be clear, this isn't in any way an Ambient release. As a huge fan of Ambient music, I see a clear distinction between it & New Age music & I'd suggest that this is a New Age release. As far as some of the better New Age music goes, I'd highlight artists like Popol Vuh, Alice Coltrane & Enigma off the top of my head.

This one is a really interesting one that's worthy of a bit of discussion. On the one hand this release is so obviously not a metal release in that if you took the black metal vocals away (which only appear on half of the tracklisting) you would essentially have a conventional New Age record, albeit one that seems to be very much intended for the black metal audience. On the other hand though, those vocals could only be found on a black metal release & some of this material would seem to fit pretty comfortably on a Burzum album given its conduciveness to drawing images of "Lord Of The Rings" style fantasy. But then there's also an early 80's new wave element to the overthetop synthesizer tones given that they often lack subtlety & tip toe along the borderline of cheesiness. It poses the question "Does black metal need to have guitars & black metal instrumentation?" I would suggest that the answer is YES & my inclination is to go with a YES on this Hall of Judgement entry as a result but I can't say that it's a unanimous decision as I can see the argument for going to other way too. Perhaps placing "The Ashes of Light" under Non-Metal but still allowing it into The North is a fair compromise. I'm not sure if that would cause any logistical issues but it's worth considering.

As for the album's quality, I can't say I agree with Sonny on that. If you can allow yourself to accept the musical direction that Lustre have taken then you might find that "The Ashes of Light" has a certain charm to it. It's glistening, lush, majestic & ethereal but will certainly alienate many extreme metal fans given its generally positive & uplifting tone. I don't mind some of the better New Age releases though & have even been known to thoroughly enjoy it in conjunction with a professional massage on occasion so I would guess that I'm more open to this sort of record than most grim & frostbitten black metal fans. It's disappointing that I couldn't find any pictures of corpse-painted black metallers receiving massages to post in the Hall of Judgement thread though as I would have thought someone would surely have pasted Abbath into that sort of scene at some point. I guess that fact alone tells us that this release is tailored towards a fairly niche market.

For fans of Burzum, Midnight Odyssey & Eldamar.

3.5/5

P.S. This is yet another example of why no one should ever treat RYM's genre tagging as gospel. That website is simply getting worse & worse & their audience & ever-expanding genre-tree consistently show that they know very little about the finer details of metal music. There is quite literally no Ambient or Atmospheric Black Metal on this release so those two primary genre tags are completely incorrect. Even if there was any Ambient here, surely the Black Ambient tag would be a better fit as I'm sure the audiences for those two genres would rather not see this release sitting in their charts.

Various Artists - "Tuva, Among the Spirits: Sound, Music and Nature in Sakha and Tuva" (1999)

A nature recordings compilation that had its moments but ended up being a bit dull.

OK, so Ben & I have discussed it & we're going to add Stenchcore to The Pit, mainly for ease of use in adding releases to the database given that a lot of these releases don't have any other metal-related primary tags on other sites & because most of these releases (although clearly best fitted to The Pit from the study group I've conducted above) wouldn't sit comfortably under Crossover Thrash or Thrash Metal tags. It's great to be able to reach an informed decision that fits in with the philosophy of the Metal Academy clan arrangement so it was a worthwhile exercise in the end.

So this concludes my Stenchcore deep dive. It's been an interesting journey that had its ups & downs. Here are my findings:

* Of the thirteen releases in the sample group I only found one that I'd suggest wasn't metal enough to qualify for Metal Academy.

* I found that I could identify the Stenchcore sound but definitely think it's more of a hybrid of two other sounds than it is a legitimate genre in its own right. It's similar to deathgrind in that way. Even its parent genre Crust Punk isn't very well defined as the lines between hardcore punk, anarcho-punk, stenchcore, thrashcore & crossover thrash are extremely blurry at times. I tend to think of Crust Punk as very dirty hardcore with a metal edge whereas Stenchcore pushes that metal edge far enough to warrant a dual tag between punk & metal. But why isn't it crossover thrash when the majority of the metal influence comes from thrash? Well.... it simply doesn't have the same sound as crossover as its much dirtier & draws its influence more from Hellhammer than Metallica.

 * Of the thirteen releases in the sample group I found only six of them to truly warrant a Stenchcore primary genre tag.

* Of the releases with a death metal component, only one really had anything to do with Stenchcore & that had an even stronger thrash metal component.

* The results pointed to The Pit being the only logical home for Stenchcore if it was to reside in the Metal Academy database.

Ben & I will review the results at some stage today & make an informed decision on whether to include Stenchcore in the Metal Academy database or not. Stay tuned.

A thrashier effort from this Boston-based stenchcore outfit.

Axegrinder - "Grind The Filth" demo (1986)

This 28 minute demo tape is a much cruder affair than the previous couple of posts & finds this London outfit still honing their craft with a stronger Crust Punk component then a metal one. I'd still suggest that there's enough stenchcore & thrash metal on offer to warrant a dual tag but the guitar tone & lighter weight punk drumming see it leaning more on the punk side of things for the majority of the run time. It's an inconsistent release in terms of quality with two dodgy intro tracks & a gimmicky attempt at humour to close out the tracklisting. There are a few decent numbers in the middle that are worth checking out though. I'd suggest that you'd be much better served by heading straight for Axegrinder's debut album "The Rise of the Serpent Men" over this one though.

For fans of Amebix, Hellbastard & Deviated Instinct.

3/5

Here's one last stenchcore outing for ya:

Lifeless Dark - "Who Will Be The Victims?" demo (2018)

A really well produced twelve minute demo of powerful US stenchcore with cool female hardcore vocals. There's a lot of Slayer worship going on but the super-heavy production job sees this release separated from the thrash crowd along with those vocals. The guitar sound is closer to Swedish death metal which is really cool. If this is an example of what I can expect from a more modern stenchcore sound then you can count me in because this is a very solid release indeed. It'd sit very comfortably in The Pit.

For fans of Sacrilege, Slayer & Hellbastard.

4/5

Check this out for some wicked stenchcore action:

Well, I'm careful about debating speed metal as it is a loose term on RYM and can vary depending on the online community.  But I'd attach it to Seventh Son and Black Hand Inn at any time.  Running Wild goes hand-in-hand with Metallica for how brutal their music can be.  Around the internet these guys are tagged as heavy metal.  Metal storm doesn't even consider them power metal.  But Metallica attracts metal fans of various types, and that's why the albums are so special.  We can't deny that the general heaviness of both albums compositions lower and in side A.  Yes, the guitars are heavy, but the band isn't always "thrashing.". On top of that, the bands I tagged are many of the most popular bands in the thrash scene.  I'd even include Annihilator, Pantera and maybe Artillery.  Obviously I'm not counting early Pantera.

Interesting perspective. Personally I'd suggest that "Seventh Son of a Seventh Son" is a heavy metal record with some progressive influences & "Black Hand Inn" sits somewhere between heavy metal & power metal. I wouldn't say that Running Wild come close to being as thrashy or brutal as Metallica's 80's classics & I've never considered them to be speed metal, despite them being commonly referred to in that way.

In regard to the bands you've added there, Annihilator & Artillery certainly have releases that include as much heavy metal influence as these two Metallica records. Pantera's "Cowboys From Hell" offers a bit of that too with plenty of Judas Priest influence in particular. I'd highlight tracks like "Psycho Holiday", "Cemetary Gates" & "Shattered" as examples of that, particularly "Cemetary Gates" with that classic Randy Rhoads style riff.

Hellbastard - "Ripper Crust" demo (1986)

This early demo tape is regarded as the source of the "Crust Punk" tag & I like it much better than Hellbastard's 1988 debut album "Heading For Internal Darkness". This one's got a stronger punk component with more up-tempo material & seems like a better fit for the Stenchcore tag in my opinion even if it's more of a Stenchcore/Thrash Metal hybrid than anything else. The tracklisting is very inconsistent but when Hellbastard get a touch more violent aggressive they can really tear shreds off ya. The Hellhammer & Slayer influences are really obvious with a few riffs being nothing short of blatant plagiarism. I really dig the gruff vocals though & completely off-the-hook lead guitar work though. This release is worth a few listens & would sit very comfortably in The Pit.

For fans of Hellhammer, Slayer & Axegrinder.

3.5/5

Albums like the first four Megadeths are too focused on thrashing front to back for that to happen, and by Countdown the thrash had been largely forsaken.  The same about thrashing front-to-back is especially true for Slayer, who rarely steered into new territory longterm until they made a straight-up punk album with Divine Intervention.  Off the top of my head, bands whose classics are excluded from this combo include Megadeth up to Rust, Slayer, Vektor, Coroner, Kreator, Sepultura, Voivod and Celtic Frost.  Metal Church is a good example of the combo (depending on who you ask), T0urniquet is definitely both and Overkill is a maybe.  And because US power metal is a direct heavy metal subgenre you could also include Iced Earth by technicality.  I'm almost done with Peace Sells, and from front to back the first thing on its mind is thrashing.  It doesn't really exercise diversity until its cover of "I Ain't Superstitious."  I guess in comparison to most thrash bands, there are only a few bands who bridge the gap.

With the exception of Megadeth, you seem to be listing bands from the more extreme end of the thrash scene there Rexorcist so I don't think that's a particularly good case study but even if we stick within that group you'll find that there were plenty of obvious heavy metal & speed metal influences on a record like Slayer's "Show No Mercy". Take "The Antichrist", "The Final Command" & "Crionics" for example. None of those are technically thrash metal tracks. They all have a lot more to do with speed metal & the NWOBHM in my opinion but we don't ever look to claim "Show No Mercy" as anything other than thrash. The same can be said for Megadeth's "Killing Is My Business... & Business Is Good!" as I'd suggest that there's a few tracks on that tracklisting that are closer to a speed/NWOBHM sound too. Look at "Chosen Ones" for example. I'm not saying that either of these albums should be tagged as speed metal or heavy metal but I don't think they're all that different to "Ride The Lightning" & "Master of Puppets" in this regard.

For the record, Slayer's punk record was "Undisputed Attitude".

I would challenge that actually. Most of the rock & metal bands out there aren't trying anything new or pushing any limits. It doesn't make them any less rock or metal & that's ok. The majority of rock/metal fans don't require it anyway as the real point of the music is simply to let off some steam & have fun. There are those that push the threshold in the interest of art & there's an audience for that too.

Black Sabbath are actually a classic example of a band who openly pushed the scope of metal out further & further by incorporating outside influences (particularly during the mid-to-late 1970's), so much so that they pushed the friendship a bit too far at times & lost their metal status altogether on records like "Technical Ecstasy", "Never Say Die!" & "Seventh Star".

You can play a metal song in whatever style you like by using the musical tools associated with your genre of choice but I believe it stops being a metal song once you remove metal guitar & drum techniques

Look, at the end of the day there's a fundamental difference between rock guitar playing & heavy metal guitar playing from a purely theoretical point of view. The hard rock technique utilizes crunchy open-string chords, bluesy pentatonic scales & traditional riff structures borrowed from blues rock. The metal one focuses heavily on the use of power chords, more adventurous chromatic structures & chuggy, palm-muted & much more rhythmic right-hand technique. The same can be said for the drumming which has its own set of theoretical rules. It really doesn't matter how heavy a band's sound is. It's about which techniques they use. GnR & Motley Crue used rock techniques in a heavy way. That's why they're rightfully tied to hard rock. In the mid-to-late 1970's Judas Priest used metal techniques in a way that isn't very heavy by today's standards. It doesn't exclude them from being metal though. That's the point I'm trying to make. The vocal style plays very much a supporting role in this argument in my opinion.

For the record, "Sad Wings of Destiny" was still very much a transitional record in that it was roughly 50/50 but the most significant tracks were comfortably the metal ones which sees it landing in my metal bucket. The same can be said of "Black Sabbath" & "Sin After Sin" actually but "Rising" doesn't get close to meeting that ratio & includes a much stronger blues backbone with tracks like "Starstruck" & "Do You Close Your Eyes" barely meeting the requirements for hard rock, let alone metal.

Let's just agree that we have very different understandings of what constitutes metal music & leave it at that, shall we?

*slowly backs out of the conversation*

I don't consider that production or general heaviness have much to do with genre-tagging to be honest. You can make a metal record that's not all that heavy & you can make a hard rock record that's really fucking heavy. It's the musical tools & techniques that are being used that define a release's genre rather than how heavy it is as far as I'm concerned. If a 70's release is mostly using hard rock tools & not metal ones then it's hard rock as far as I'm concerned. Legitimate metal was being played by a few bands back in the 70's (see "Paranoid", "Stained Class", etc.) so there's a clear differentiator as far as I can see. Black Sabbath & Judas Priest were consistently using metal tools in the 70's & those tools are still the exact same ones used in heavy metal today so it really doesn't matter what era they come from. They'd still be tagged as heavy metal if their 70's records were released tomorrow as we regularly see that in the retro trend that's been so popular in recent times. Rainbow, Scorpions & Budgie only used metal tools very occasionally amidst a predominantly hard rock driven backbone in my opinion & as such don't qualify as metal. As I said, I don't think we're going to agree here.

I like this wolverine idea & think it ties in really well with the clan in question actually.

What I'm saying is those other albums spend more time doing actual thrashing with lots of energy where Metallica spends more time with build-up, melody and slowing down some, especially in MoP's case since it's a bit longer than RtL or Rust in Peace.

I would suggest that what you're referring to is more of a progressive influence than a heavy metal one (admittedly borrowed from Iron Maiden's "Powerslave" as much as anywhere else) but I don't think anyone can accuse tracks like "Battery" & "Damage Inc." of mucking about.

And keep in mind that Rising was released in a time when metal itself was closer to hard rock.  We're talking about a ten-year difference during the early development of metal, so the exact standard gets technical.

I see where you're coming from & it's certainly in line with what a big majority of the metal scene feel on the matter but I actually don't think the period when a record was released should have any impact on its genre tagging personally. It either is or it isn't & that needs to be by the modern understanding of the genre classifications in my opinion. Genre-tags are essentially for directing people to music that they're likely to enjoy so I don't think it makes much sense to use the historical meaning of a term when classifying music, particularly when most of the target audience weren't even born at the time of release. (See First Wave of Black Metal for a prime example of why.) Plus, the differentiator between hard rock & heavy metal is widely considered to be the blues component which "Rising" has plenty of. If "Rising" is heavy metal then it makes the hard rock genre completely redundant as far as I can see.

Anyway... I think we'll have to agree to disagree here but it was good healthy discussion that got me thinking nonetheless. Keep 'em coming! :)

Sludgy Californian death metal.

Stormcrow - "Enslaved In Darkness" (2005)

Once again we have a release that has very little to do with Crust Punk or what I understand Stenchcore to be. The sole full-length from this Californian five-piece is more of a sludgy death metal record & I feel that it's only the hardcore bark of front man Brian & the punky Entombed-ish beats under some of the death metal riffs that leads people to claim this as a Stenchcore release. The filthy guitar tone sits somewhere between early Bolt Thrower & the classic Swedish death metal sound while there are a number of doomier sections that remind me a fair bit of Asphyx & represent some of the highlights of the album. The B Side sees the band heading in a sludgier direction with some of the material bringing to mind bands like High On Fire. The thick production job is the clear strength for this record as Stormcrow clearly possess a well-defined & super-crushing sound. Each song includes a riff or two that let's them down a little though & a bit of quality control could easily have turned this from a pretty decent record into a really great one. It's not all that far off but doesn't quite get there in the end in my opinion. "Enslaved In Darkness" sits pretty comfortably in The Horde & doesn't really need any other tag other than Death Metal, despite the clear sludge leanings.

For fans of Bolt Thrower, Entombed & Mammoth Grinder.

3.5/5

I'm not entirely sure that we can make that claim.  Off the top of my head, Arise, the first five Slayers, Beneath the Remains and Rust in Peace barely have any straight-up heavy metal.  Take an album from this collection and it's 90-100% thrashing.

I'd dispute that actually. "Rust In Peace" & Slayer's "Show No Mercy" definitely have a classic metal influence in the same way that those Metallica records do in my opinion. What about records like "Spreading The Disease", "Practice What You Preach" & "The Years of Decay"? I'd suggest that they all do too but it doesn't make them heavy metal records or any less relevant to the thrash metal genre. Put it this way, yesterday it was decided in the Hall of Judgement to keep Rainbow's "Rising" under the Heavy Metal banner. Do you think these two Metallica records belong in the same genre as "Rising"?

I've had to go with NO votes on these two. Despite what most people seem to say, there really wasn't that big an increase in Heavy Metal influence with "Rise The Lightning" in my opinion. It was just that the influences that were already so visible on "Kill 'Em All" (which contained a good half an album of Heavy/Speed Metal if you examine it track by track just quietly) were used in a more accessible & sophisticated way & were better integrated into their sound (thanks Cliff) but at the same time the thrash components were filed down to a razor sharp point. Sure, "For Whom The Bell Tolls", "Fade To Black" & "Escape" have plenty to do with your more classic Heavy Metal model & transcend the basic building blocks of early thrash but I think it's fair to say that those songs don't really sound like the Maidens & Priests of the world either (well... "Escape" might). The remainder of the album represents the pinnacle of what Thrash Metal can be with five of the eight tracks being pure, elite-level Thrash Metal & that's a stronger ratio of thrash-to-heavy/speed metal than "Kill 'Em All" can boast. "Ride The Lightning" has been that influential & readily emulated since that if we're going to claim it as being Heavy Metal then I feel that we're going to be claiming the same with a good half of all the thrash records that have been released since too (I'm looking at you Overkill). I don't think it's a coincidence that I can't think of many heavy metal records that have tracks as intense & extreme as "Fight Fire With Fire" & "Trapped Under Ice" on them. I can say very similar things about "Master Of Puppets" to be honest only probably more so. Just my two cents...

These two releases have been added to the Hall of Judgement.

Excellent. Thanks for that. Fleshgod Apocalypse's "Agony” is another old nomination that’s very close to an outcome.

Could The Sphere be an alien? Or would that be The Infinite? I was actually thinking The Infinite could be an angel. A raven is about as good a representation of The North as we’ve heard to date. An eagle is another idea for The Guardians.

It’s simply because we haven’t had enough interested/active members to consistently acquire the votes required to reach a verdict. We have of course had the option to reduce the limit so as to force some results however Ben & I feel that a best-of-fifteen vote arrangement is the minimum required to reach a clear & accurate consensus so we’ve remained patient & hopeful that things would pick up. They seem to be heading in the right direction lately so we could see an increase in outcomes.

Yeah I’d say it’s been a bit over three years. Ben & I did the Metal Academy podcast for a few years before that before deciding that we could no longer invest the time to do it justice.

In answer to your question about Hall entry duplication, all completed Hall entries are clearly visible if you choose to look at them & I simply wouldn’t publish any that had been done previously.

This Hall of Judgement entry has finally faced judgement & has been denied following a closely contested but ultimately unanimous vote tally of 8 NO to 6 YES. Thank you to all The Guardians members who have participated & made your voices heard. I'll retreat with my tail between my legs, shall I?

If you haven't already voted on it Rexorcist, Rainbow's "Rising" is only one or two votes away from an outcome.

The social media route is a fairly unforgiving one as you get very little bang for buck in my experience. The more angles we attack this from simultaneously the better though so it would be great if anyone wants to chip in by giving us some additional publicity on their own feeds. Obviously the more content we have going on in the forums the better but I think it's also important to have people using our wider functionality when newcomers are examining the site. For this reason I've been making a conscious effort to check out at least one of the Hall of Judgement entries I haven't contributed to each month, starting with the oldest ones so that we can try to bring them to an outcome. If anyone else would like to participate in that exercise it'd be greatly appreciated as we have so many Hall entries that only need one of two votes to close out right now. Ultimately though, the best way to get more members is through word of mouth so please tell everyone you know that might be interested about the Academy. If everyone does that then I think we'll do very well. There's definitely been a noticeable pickup in activity of late which is encouraging because these things just need to reach a certain tipping point before the snowballing effect starts to really take hold.

On this subject, I'm working on a top 100 metal albums list, but I want to provide commentary for each entry.  Is there a special place where I can create a separate thread and post a few at a time until it's done over the course of a few days so people have albums to talk about for each post?  Or is the general chat section good?  I plan on doing this the same way people on Movieforums post their top 100 movie lists, and I'm doing it this way on Metalforum too.

I'd suggest using our LISTS functionality for this as you can create an attractive & easy to navigate view of the list & also add commentaries. We already have a thread in the General forums for people's Top 25 releases of all time so I'd probably use that for any conversation.

Deviated Instinct - "Rock 'n' Roll Conformity" (1988)

This one's a traditional Crust Punk record with the metal component being easily covered by that tag & the best moments reaching out into Thrashcore territory. I'm led to believe that the band's later releases offer more of a metal component so perhaps this one has simply been dragged along for the ride. There's a crap-tonne of speed, intensity & punk rock energy here & I'd suggest that fans of the more extreme hardcore will probably drool over this record. If it had to be added to the Academy database then I'd suggest it should sit under Non-Metal. The Pit would be the closest fit of the proper clans.

For fans of Axegrinder, Amebix & Hellbastard.

3.5/5

This release has been added to the Hall of Judgement.

Two Hall entries have been created for this nomination.

This release has now been posted in the Hall of Judgement.

I've added "Aenima", "Lateralus" & "10,000 Days" to the Hall of Judgement.

For the record, people should feel free to submit as many releases for judgement as they feel like as long as they feel they're legitimately mistagged.

A doomier number from this early 90's English deathgrind outfit.

Prophecy of Doom - "Acknowledge The Confusion Master" (1990)

This is another release that I picked up during my tape trading days & very quickly forgot about. I was surprised to see it listed as Stenchcore actually as I didn't remember it being anything outside of my usual extreme metal comfort zone & it would seem that my memory is not all that bad for an old fella because this is nothing more than a low grade deathgrind record. You'll get the tremolo-picked death metal riffage of Bolt Thrower blended with the mid-paced grind grooves of 1989-90 period Napalm Death & late 80's Carcass. The annoyingly gurgled vocal delivery is very much in line with the Carcass model with high-pitched screams bursting out of the speakers at extremely high volumes to make sure that you're paying attention. I find that element of the band's sound to be a real weakness to be honest as it's pretty hard to take seriously. Doomy album highlight "Prophetic Believers Act" sees Prophecy of Doom slowing things down a bit & adding a layer of atmosphere & I believe that's the direction they would take on later releases but I've not had the pleasure of hearing any of their other material to date. So where is the Crust Punk here? I think people are just confusing the Grindcore component to be honest as there's virtually no legitimate punk here. This release should stay in The Horde where it belongs & once again the Stenchcore deep dive has dipped to a new low point.

For fans of Napalm Death, Carcass & Bolt Thrower.

3/5